Collusion update: "no factual evidence"

[Charles]

To a conspiracy nut, the lack of evidence is the most convincing evidence of all.

"That just proves a cover-up!"

Ironically you provided no evidence for the claim. You expect the readers of your posts to be conspiracy nuts?

[Charles]

And with you're implying that Senate Intelligence Committee Chairman Richard Burr and Vice Chairman Mark Warner are either dishonest or ignorant when they say there is no evidence.

Granted, I don't think either of them are the most trustworthy of characters, but I'm inclined to take their word on the matter over yours, especially since they can both be considered hostile witnesses -- one is a "never-Trump" Republican and the other is a Democrat, so they have no reason to lie about this. And considering they've been intensely investigating this matter for some time, your charge of "ignorant" isn't going to stick, either.

Here is what the article actually said:

Burr said there is “no factual evidence today that we’ve received” on collusion or conspiracy between Russia and President Donald Trump’s campaign. But he said he’s still open on the issue and hasn’t personally come to any final conclusions, since the investigation isn’t finished.

[Mountain Man]

Nevertheless the Report of the Senate Committee, of which Richard Burr is Chairman, “supports three U.S. intelligence agencies’ conclusion that Russia tried to help Donald Trump win the 2016 U.S. presidential election.”

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1JT2YB

And your man says that he “still open on the issue and hasn’t personally come to any final conclusions, since the investigation isn’t finished.” A more reasonable position to take than your ongoing blanket exoneration, come what may, of the man you love.

And yet Burr and Warner have since directly contradicted that report. So which version of their narrative is the right one?

[JimL]

As far as you're concerned, Trump is guilty even if the investigation is concluded without finding a stitch of evidence to support such charges -- which is by far the most likely outcome at this point. Even then you won't concede that Trump is innocent, you'll just tell yourself that they didn't look hard to prove him guilty.

You're projecting, MM. Trump will be innocent in your mind no matter what the outcome of the investigation. From my perspective, yes, there is already sufficient evidence, evidence which you are blind to, that points to the guilt of Trump and his administration with respect to collusion, coverup/obstruction of justice, financial crimes, not to mention just being an immoral jackass not fit for the presidency. You know, your kind of guy!

[firstfloor]

Trump has been duped by Putin. He is a fool and his base are simpletons.

[Mountain Man]

You're projecting, MM. Trump will be innocent in your mind no matter what the outcome of the investigation. From my perspective, yes, there is already sufficient evidence, evidence which you are blind to, that points to the guilt of Trump and his administration with respect to collusion, coverup/obstruction of justice, financial crimes, not to mention just being an immoral jackass not fit for the presidency. You know, your kind of guy!

Liberal delusion, or biting satire?

You make the call!

[JimL]

Trump has been duped by Putin. He is a fool and his base are simpletons.

Except, I'm not so sure he's been duped.

[Terraceth]

To say there is no evidence of a conspiracy is to be dishonest or ignorant. Donald Trump publicly asking the Russians to try to find the missing Hillary emails and them responding by hacking into the DNC email server is evidence of a conspiracy.

That was just him joking or being sarcastic. Even if the Russians actually did decide to take him up on the offer, someone taking a joke request seriously hardly seems to be a conspiracy.

Also, while I'll admit that I don't have that high an opinion of Trump's intelligence, I do think that even he's smart enough to know that if you're legitimately asking someone to do something illegal, Twitter (possibly the most public venue on the planet) is not the place to do that.

[JimL]

That was just him joking or being sarcastic. Even if the Russians actually did decide to take him up on the offer, someone taking a joke request seriously hardly seems to be a conspiracy.

Also, while I'll admit that I don't have that high an opinion of Trump's intelligence, I do think that even he's smart enough to know that if you're legitimately asking someone to do something illegal, Twitter (possibly the most public venue on the planet) is not the place to do that.

It is collusion whether Trump knew he was commiting it or not. Same with Don Jr. and his Trump tower meeting with the Russians. And to believe Trumps request to the Russians was just a joke is naive to say the least. It may or may not have been a conspiracy, but the latter, Jr's Tower meeting certainly was. But, people seem to forget that Trump already admitted to obstruction when telling his Russian buddies in the oval office that he just fired Comey and got that Russian investigation pressure off.

And btw, Trump signaled the Russian intel to hack Clinton and the DNC the only way he could, since the administration was thwarted early on in trying to set up their back channel.

[Tassman]

That was just him joking or being sarcastic. Even if the Russians actually did decide to take him up on the offer, someone taking a joke request seriously hardly seems to be a conspiracy.

the Russians actually did decide to take him up on the offer, "The same day Trump asked Russia to find Hillary Clinton's missing emails, Russians tried to hack Clinton-affiliated emails".

https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...mueller-2018-7

Also, while I'll admit that I don't have that high an opinion of Trump's intelligence, I do think that even he's smart enough to know that if you're legitimately asking someone to do something illegal, Twitter (possibly the most public venue on the planet) is not the place to do that.

"Intelligence", or lack thereof, has little to do with the high sense of personal entitlement typically exhibited by a Narcissistic Personalty like Trump.

[Tassman]

Except, I'm not so sure he's been duped.

More like kompromat, Putin owns him.

[Mountain Man]

It is collusion whether Trump knew he was commiting it or not. Same with Don Jr. and his Trump tower meeting with the Russians. And to believe Trumps request to the Russians was just a joke is naive to say the least. It may or may not have been a conspiracy, but the latter, Jr's Tower meeting certainly was. But, people seem to forget that Trump already admitted to obstruction when telling his Russian buddies in the oval office that he just fired Comey and got that Russian investigation pressure off.

And btw, Trump signaled the Russian intel to hack Clinton and the DNC the only way he could, since the administration was thwarted early on in trying to set up their back channel.

And yet the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee says "no factual evidence" that the Trump campaign did anything wrong, and the vice chairman says there's no indication that the Russian government favored one candidate over the other. But I guess you know better.

[oxmixmudd]

And yet the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee says "no factual evidence" that the Trump campaign did anything wrong, and the vice chairman says there's no indication that the Russian government favored one candidate over the other. But I guess you know better.

Nothing wrong?

Such a statement in fact makes you complicit in Trump's lying and immorality. We have listed what is known and what in any other time in us history would have resulted in immediate irrecoverable scandal and impeachment. In fact, no other president or candidate for president I know of (with the possible exception of Bill Clinton who weathered the Lewinsky scandal) was of such low moral character and had such an absence of conscience as to have not already willingly resigned for the good of the country (even Nixon eventually resigned rather than drag the county through impeachment) over the shame their actions have brought upon themselves and the office of the president.

If you can't even acknowledge what is known about Trump's lying and immoral if not necessarily illegal activities as he enlisted the help of a foreign government to win the campaign then the you have allowed your love of this world to steal the truth from your soul.


Jim

[Mountain Man]

Nothing wrong?

Such a statement in fact makes you complicit in Trump's lying and immorality. We have listed what is known and what in any other time in us history would have resulted in immediate irrecoverable scandal and impeachment. In fact, no other president or candidate for president I know of was of such low moral character and had such an absence of conscience as to have not already willingly resigned for the good of the country over the shame their actions have brought upon themselves and the office of the president.

If you can't even acknowledge what is known about Trump's lying and immoral if not necessarily illegal activities as he enlisted the help of a foreign government to win the campaign then the you have allowed your love of this world to steal the truth from your soul.


Jim

Are you suggesting that the Senate Intelligence Committee is in Trump's back pocket? Or maybe Putin is pulling all the strings in Washington!

Oh, and I'll never get tired of self-righteous holier-than-thou types trying to turn everything into a spiritual issue.

"You disagree with me? Well, I wonder if you're a 'Real Christian',"

[oxmixmudd]

That was just him joking or being sarcastic. Even if the Russians actually did decide to take him up on the offer, someone taking a joke request seriously hardly seems to be a conspiracy.

Also, while I'll admit that I don't have that high an opinion of Trump's intelligence, I do think that even he's smart enough to know that if you're legitimately asking someone to do something illegal, Twitter (possibly the most public venue on the planet) is not the place to do that.

Plausible deniability is more likely. And DT has demonstrated no such restraint. He routinely admits to actions that are in fact obstruction of Justice (and may well yet catch up to him) on Twitter. That man has no filter and no conscience. He is the definition of liar. He lies even when he has no obvious need to lie. And as is evidenced in his pulling of security clearances, he has no qualms about abusing his power if he thinks it will benefit him personally, even if it is to the detriment of the US. We need those experienced former intelligence people to retain their clearances so their experience and knowledge is available to those currently in office. But does Trump care about the US and what is best for it? No, he'd rather get his little revenge fit satisfied. This is the sort of person people, and for the most part evangelical Christian people, are supporting. It is itself a scandal. So much so the Evangelical Protestants pointing their fingers at the Catholic Pedophile Priest scandal had best consider we all will stand before an impartial and just judge in the end. And I am not sure that supporting this man on his rampage through immorality is any less evil than the sort of cover-up we saw from the Bishops who chose to try to protect those Pedophile Priests. Both are ignoring gross immorality for personal gain.

Jim