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Time To Smear Kavanaugh's Good Name...

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  • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    The "evidence" for Kavanaugh lying is even thinner than Ford's allegations, Jim. You think he should be automatically disqualified if he's partisan? That sword cuts both ways, Jim. And if you think that was uncontrolled temper, you've never seen the real thing.
    The evidence of his lying to Congress is beyond doubt, both under oath in 2006 when working for the Bush administration, and during his confirmation hearing in September. That you can't admit to that only shows that you are either ignorant as to his testimony, or you just refuse to see the facts and could never admit to them.
    Last edited by JimL; 10-12-2018, 09:34 PM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      Wow - I hadn't heard THAT nutter question before.
      There was more than that one line to which you responded. Obviously it escaped your notice. So just for you:

      On balance of probability, given Dr Ford's credible testimony (even acknowledged as such by Trump at the time), combined with Kavanaugh's substantive reputation among contemporary's as an aggressive, belligerent drunk, very likely prone to the memory blackouts commonplace among such people, then is is a reasonable assumption that Kavanaugh is guilty as charged.

      Unfortunately, so determined was Trump's support base to get Kavanaugh confirmed, that the additional corroborative evidence required to reinforce this probability was deliberately curtained by the WH's limitations placed upon the FBI investigation. But who cares about truth and justice in this regime? Answer: Not Trump, he has his Evangelical base to keep happy.
      “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
        The evidence of his lying to Congress is beyond doubt, both under oath in 2006 when working for the Bush administration, and during his confirmation hearing in September. That you can't admit to that only shows that you are either ignorant as to his testimony, or you just refuse to see the facts and could never admit to them.
        You keep asserting it, but you keep failing to produce the evidence asked for. Why, did your masters not program you with that part?
        "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
        GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

        Comment


        • Originally posted by tassman View Post
          there was more than that one line to which you responded.
          nonsense!!!!
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
            You keep asserting it, but you keep failing to produce the evidence asked for. Why, did your masters not program you with that part?
            JimL knows we want evidence, so he thinks he's scoring points by withholding it. Of course, in this case, the "evidence" is apparently so thin I didn't even see it pop up in Yahoo's news stream, which is willing to run pretty much anything that can be construed as anti-Trump.
            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
            sigpic
            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

            Comment


            • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
              It is my opinion that 'fingers in the ears' is fairly common in Civics 101, and that most of the time when the accusations is levied, the one making the accusation is about as guilty as the one being accused.

              Jim
              I see your opinion, and up the ante by opining that those with fingers in their ears are rarely aware of just where their fingers are.
              Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

              Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
              sigpic
              I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

              Comment


              • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                I see your opinion, and up the ante by opining that those with fingers in their ears are rarely aware of just where their fingers are.
                If my fingers are in my ears, I can't see them. But I can see yours.

                I really get the difficulty OBP. And I am not claiming I'm not guilty. I'm just saying I don't see anyone willing to listen to anyone that doesn't already agree with them.

                Jim
                My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                Comment


                • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
                  If my fingers are in my ears, I can't see them. But I can see yours.

                  I really get the difficulty OBP. And I am not claiming I'm not guilty. I'm just saying I don't see anyone willing to listen to anyone that doesn't already agree with them.

                  Jim
                  I'm more than willing to look for middle ground - but no one seems interested in that. When the other side is painted as evil incarnate, you're not going to find many willing to listen.
                  Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                  Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                  sigpic
                  I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                    I'm more than willing to look for middle ground - but no one seems interested in that. When the other side is painted as evil incarnate, you're not going to find many willing to listen.
                    I can say that Trump's push for turkey to release the pastor was a good thing. I think his position on Israel is good. He does seem to have been good for the economy. His desire to tighten the borders is good, the implementation notwithstanding.


                    Jim
                    My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                    If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                    This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                      It's hardly worth my time with you Lipix, you could simply google it yourself if you truly cared to know. But here you are. Kavanaugh was found to have lied to Congress back in 2006 when he said under oath that he had nothing to do with the rules governing the detention of combatants,
                      To claim he lied requires both creative reinterpretation of his statements in addition to taking them out of context. See here.

                      he denied having knowledge of and participating in the GOP's hacking of Senate Democrat computer files which were used to get Bush nominated judges confirmed.
                      And there is no proof to indicate he did have knowledge. The situation was that Manuel Miranda managed to get copies of various Democrat computer files (through meanings that were technically not illegal) and then shared the information he found with others, including Kavanaugh. But in all of their published e-mails, there's not proof that Kavanaugh actually knew the information came from the copied Democratic memos.

                      When you make goofy, baseless accusations like this, it's hard to take the rest of what you say seriously.

                      And he lied in September concerning the nature of his drinking as well as the meaning of his yearbook entries, i.e. the meaning of "the devils triangle", "Boofing" and Renate Alumnus. The fact that he lied under oath is in itself disqualifying for a seat on the highest court in the land.
                      These accusations have a little more merit in that they're not completely baseless, but have problems regardless. First, even if what Kavanaugh stated about their definitions was wrong, that doesn't equal a lie because he could have been mistaken--I know I probably forgot most of the slang terms used back when I was in high school. But whether his statements were even incorrect is another issue. In regards to the yearbook, the claims he lied comes from some former classmates saying the statements weren't true (although some of these "claims" come through third parties and thus is not possible to double-check), but then you can find former classmates who say that the statements Kavanaugh made were true. Of course, you immediately jump into believing whichever side happens to confirm your pre-existing partisan biases (to be fair, the conservatives do that also).

                      In regards to the drinking habits, as far as I can tell that's speculation. His basic statement was that he did drink a lot, maybe even too much, but never blacked out. It's questionable that he never went that far, but it's ultimately speculative to claim that he most definitely did black out and therefore lied, unless someone actually has evidence of that, which (to my knowledge) there is none. There was a classmate who said Kavanaugh was a heavy enough drinker that he doubted that Kavanaugh never blacked out, but even they never claimed they were sure he never blacked out. So your claim it's a "fact" that he lied under oath is incorrect.

                      If someone wants to argue that his claims regarding the drinking or yearbook were questionable, fine, but to claim they were definitely lies is reaching far beyond the facts.

                      Comment


                      • ‘questionable’ is not anadequate standard for a Supreme Court judge.
                        “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
                        “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
                        “not all there” - you know who you are

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
                          To claim he lied requires both creative reinterpretation of his statements in addition to taking them out of context. See here.

                          And there is no proof to indicate he did have knowledge. The situation was that Manuel Miranda managed to get copies of various Democrat computer files (through meanings that were technically not illegal) and then shared the information he found with others, including Kavanaugh. But in all of their published e-mails, there's not proof that Kavanaugh actually knew the information came from the copied Democratic memos.

                          When you make goofy, baseless accusations like this, it's hard to take the rest of what you say seriously.

                          These accusations have a little more merit in that they're not completely baseless, but have problems regardless. First, even if what Kavanaugh stated about their definitions was wrong, that doesn't equal a lie because he could have been mistaken--I know I probably forgot most of the slang terms used back when I was in high school. But whether his statements were even incorrect is another issue. In regards to the yearbook, the claims he lied comes from some former classmates saying the statements weren't true (although some of these "claims" come through third parties and thus is not possible to double-check), but then you can find former classmates who say that the statements Kavanaugh made were true. Of course, you immediately jump into believing whichever side happens to confirm your pre-existing partisan biases (to be fair, the conservatives do that also).

                          In regards to the drinking habits, as far as I can tell that's speculation. His basic statement was that he did drink a lot, maybe even too much, but never blacked out. It's questionable that he never went that far, but it's ultimately speculative to claim that he most definitely did black out and therefore lied, unless someone actually has evidence of that, which (to my knowledge) there is none. There was a classmate who said Kavanaugh was a heavy enough drinker that he doubted that Kavanaugh never blacked out, but even they never claimed they were sure he never blacked out. So your claim it's a "fact" that he lied under oath is incorrect.

                          If someone wants to argue that his claims regarding the drinking or yearbook were questionable, fine, but to claim they were definitely lies is reaching far beyond the facts.
                          This isn't a criminal trial Terraceth, it's a confirmation hearing for a lifetime seat on the SC. To believe that Kavanaugh wasn't lying about all of the above would be to believe that he is extremely stupid and in either case its disqualifying. The point is that Kavanaugh obviously isn't stupid, so it is more likely than not, even if you don't have absolute proof, that he was lying.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            nonsense!!!!
                            Well no, there was demonstrably more than the one line to which you responded, if "response" is the correct word. There were two paragraphs, which apparently you were unable to argue against. But why should you bother? You got what you wanted and we all know you opportunistic Evangelicals don’t care what it takes to get your own way.

                            “Why Evangelicals Support President Trump, Despite His Immorality.”

                            http://time.com/5161349/president-tr...-slaveholders/

                            But whilst you may win the battle you are losing the war and it’s your own fault.

                            “Trends are unmistakable. According to polls conducted by the Pew Foundation, 23 percent of Generation X Americans (born between 1965-1980) claim no religious affiliation. That number rises to 34 percent of older millennials (born between 1981-1989), and to 36 percent of younger millennials (born between 1990 and 1996). Although the retreat from traditional forms of Christianity has long been apparent in western European countries, the pattern of a declining attachment to religion in the young is unprecedented in American history.

                            https://www.thedailybeast.com/blame-...hristian-faith
                            “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                              ...
                              “Why Evangelicals Support President Trump, Despite His Immorality.” ...
                              So, presumably you believe we should have said, "No way we will vote for this or any other immoral person!" Presumably you would have found that to be laudable.

                              Would you find the following similarly praiseworthy?

                              -- "No way we will vote for a Roman Catholic!"

                              -- "No way we will vote for an Orthodox believer!"

                              -- "No way we will vote for a Jew!"

                              -- "No way we will vote for a Mormon!"

                              -- "No way we will vote for a Jehovah's Witness!"

                              -- "No way we will vote for an atheist or any other infidel!"
                              Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                              Beige Federalist.

                              Nationalist Christian.

                              "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                              Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                              Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                              Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                              Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                              Justice for Matthew Perna!

                              Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                                So, presumably you believe we should have said, "No way we will vote for this or any other immoral person!" Presumably you would have found that to be laudable.
                                You are presenting a logical fallacy know as the false dichotomy. There are many more choices than blind support vs absoute rejection.

                                One of the alternates would be to push back hard on Trump when he veers into immoral territory, or when he acts unwisely. To let him know beyond a shadow of a doubt that any support he got was just because of the two available choices he happened to be a slightly better choice overall, but by no means a good choice.

                                Jim
                                My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                                If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                                This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                                Comment

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