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Manafort fesses up.

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  • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Mmmm... nah, I'll stick with my original answer.
    Well colour me surprised. Not really...'denial' is your middle name given we know that Cohen, Manafort and other close associates of Trump, are all charged with crimes and all have had connections with Russia.
    “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
      Well colour me surprised. Not really...'denial' is your middle name given we know that Cohen, Manafort and other close associates of Trump, are all charged with crimes and all have had connections with Russia.
      None of the indictments have anything to do with the camaign, and having "connections with Russia" is not a crime.
      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
      Than a fool in the eyes of God


      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
        None of the indictments have anything to do with the camaign, and having "connections with Russia" is not a crime.
        Well we have:

        Michael Flynn, Trump’s national security adviser, on one count of lying to the FBI

        Rick Gates, Trump’s former deputy campaign manager and Manafort protιgι, on one count of conspiracy against the United States and one count of making false statements to FBI agents

        George Papadopoulos, a low-level Trump foreign policy adviser, for making false statements to the FBI about his contacts with Russians during the campaign.

        Michael Cohen, Trump’s former lawyer and fixer who committed campaign finance violations related to hush money payments he made to porn actress Stormy Daniels

        And now Manafort, who was campaign chairman and chief strategist,

        There is no public evidence that Trump himself committed a crime. YET, that we know of. But he hired all these people and ALL had connections to Russia; we already know from Intel that Russia interfered with and meddled with the campaign.

        Coincidence much? What does Breitbart tell you to believe?
        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          I know a few anti-social "Christians", but, for the most part, we're a very social lot.
          I don't meet many anti-social people either, because they're antisocial.

          Obviously all the Christians you meet at your church are sufficiently social to have made it to a gathering. The anti-social ones aren't there and so you don't meet them.
          "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
          "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
          "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Starlight View Post
            I don't meet many anti-social people either, because they're antisocial.

            Obviously all the Christians you meet at your church are sufficiently social to have made it to a gathering.
            So far, so good - but you're about to go off the rails....

            The anti-social ones aren't there and so you don't meet them.
            And, once again, you show what a profoundly ignorant goofus you are - the MAJORITY of my ministry is outside the church.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              Well we have:

              Michael Flynn, Trump’s national security adviser, on one count of lying to the FBI
              A crime that has nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              Rick Gates, Trump’s former deputy campaign manager and Manafort protιgι, on one count of conspiracy against the United States and one count of making false statements to FBI agents
              A crime that has nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              George Papadopoulos, a low-level Trump foreign policy adviser, for making false statements to the FBI about his contacts with Russians during the campaign.
              A crime that has nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              Michael Cohen, Trump’s former lawyer and fixer who committed campaign finance violations related to hush money payments he made to porn actress Stormy Daniels
              No crime was committed according to the former chairman of the FEC.

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              And now Manafort, who was campaign chairman and chief strategist,
              He plead guilty to crimes that were committed years before Trump even announced his candidacy and that have nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              But [Trump] hired all these people and ALL had connections to Russia
              So what? People on Hillary's campaign staff, and even Hillary herself, had connections to Russia. That's not a crime.

              Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
              ...we already know from Intel that Russia interfered with and meddled with the campaign.
              According to DEMOCRAT Senator Mark Warner of the Senate Intelligence Committee, to whatever extent the Russians "meddled", there is zero evidence they favored one candidate over another.

              And you're a big fan of Bob Woodward, right? I seem to recall you praising him in the most glowing and effusive manner. Ah, right, you called him a meticulous researcher and made a big deal out the fact that he's won two Pulitzers, so presumably you consider him a trustworthy source, correct? Well, when asked if he found any evidence of collusion while researching his recently released book, he said, "I did not, and of course, I looked for it, looked for it hard." The host asked him later in the interview if he had seen any evidence at all. Woodward replied, "I have not." Before closing the interview, the host asked a third time to confirm that Woodward did not find any evidence despite spending two-years of his life digging for it. Woodward answered, "That is correct."

              https://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi...two_years.html
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                George Papadopoulos, a low-level Trump foreign policy adviser, for making false statements to the FBI about his contacts with Russians during the campaign.
                A crime that has nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".
                Really? Making false statements about contacting Russian government agents while working on the Trump campaign has nothing to do with colluding with Russians or the Trump campaign?
                Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                  And you're a big fan of Bob Woodward, right? I seem to recall you praising him in the most glowing and effusive manner. Ah, right, you called him a meticulous researcher and made a big deal out the fact that he's won two Pulitzers, so presumably you consider him a trustworthy source, correct? Well, when asked if he found any evidence of collusion while researching his recently released book, he said, "I did not, and of course, I looked for it, looked for it hard." The host asked him later in the interview if he had seen any evidence at all. Woodward replied, "I have not." Before closing the interview, the host asked a third time to confirm that Woodward did not find any evidence despite spending two-years of his life digging for it. Woodward answered, "That is correct."
                  Selective quoting. You see what you want to see. "Woodward said he looked 'hard' for collusion and didn't find it, but he still thinks Mueller has 'something' on Trump".

                  https://www.businessinsider.com/bob-...n-trump-2018-9
                  “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Ignorant Roy View Post
                    Really? Making false statements about contacting Russian government agents while working on the Trump campaign has nothing to do with colluding with Russians or the Trump campaign?
                    What was he actually indicted for?

                    Hint: It had nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Tassmoron View Post
                      Selective quoting. You see what you want to see. "Woodward said he looked 'hard' for collusion and didn't find it, but he still thinks Mueller has 'something' on Trump".

                      https://www.businessinsider.com/bob-...n-trump-2018-9
                      Woodward can believe whatever he wants. The question is, what evidence did he find after two-years of meticulous research to support his beliefs? And the answer is very simple:

                      None.
                      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                      Than a fool in the eyes of God


                      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                        Selective quoting. You see what you want to see. "Woodward said he looked 'hard' for collusion and didn't find it, but he still thinks Mueller has 'something' on Trump".

                        https://www.businessinsider.com/bob-...n-trump-2018-9
                        After reading his book I can't say I think much of Woodward. It was a poorly written book IMO, and Woodward came across as being far too credulous and naive in believing what his sources were saying and painting them in the good light they obviously wished to be portrayed in. The first half of the book was largely foreign policy discussion that didn't involve Trump at all.

                        Given what Woodward's book does and doesn't cover, I'd say Woodward does not appear to have interviewed any of the people in the Trump Tower meeting. However it seems pretty clear in the book that the rest of the Trump staffers / cabinet (who Woodward has talked to) were rather baffled by the Russia investigation because they weren't aware of anything tying Trump to Russia and they assumed he was innocent. So it seems any Russia connection is/was limited to the people at the Trump Tower meeting (namely Trump's family and Manafort) and possibly Cohen.

                        Nonetheless it was fairly clear in Woodward's book that Mueller seems to think he has something. In the last chapters of the book Trump's lawyers who are personal acquaintances of Mueller go to Mueller for a chit chat and basically say "this investigation's a joke right? The President's obviously not colluding with Russia, we've given you all the evidence you asked for, and there's obviously no evidence that he's colluding", and Mueller gives them the "actually, this is dead serious, and I'm not sure you're not working for Russia" silent treatment look.

                        So it is clear from the book that Woodward thinks Mueller has something pretty serious, but everybody Woodward talked to among Trump's cabinet was utterly baffled about what it might be.
                        "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                        "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                        "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                          What was he actually indicted for?
                          With emphasis:
                          Defendant PAPADOPOULOS made the following material false statements and material omissions to the FBI:
                          ...
                          b.
                          Defendant PAPADOPOULOS further told the investigating agents that the professor was "a nothing" and "just a guy talk[ing] up connections or something." In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS understood that the professor had substantial connections to Russian government officials (and had met with some ofthose officials in Moscow immediately prior to telling defendant PAPADOPOULOS about the "thousands of emails") and, over a period of months, defendant PAPADOPOULOS repeatedly sought to use the professor's Russian connections in an effort to arrange a meeting between the Campaign and Russian government officials

                          c.
                          Defendant PAPADOPOULOS claimed he met a certain female Russian national before he joined the Campaign and that their communications consisted of emails such as, '"Hi , how are you?"' In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS met the female Russian national on or about March 24, 2016, after he had become an adviser to the Campaign; he believed that she had connections to Russian government officials; and he sought to use her Russian connections over a period of months in an effort to arrange a meeting between the Campaign and Russian government officials.


                          Hint: It had nothing to do with the Trump campaign or "Russian collusion".
                          He was indicted for making false statements to the FBI about attempts to arrange meetings between the Trump campaign and Russian government officials.
                          Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                          MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                          MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                          seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Roy View Post
                            With emphasis:
                            Defendant PAPADOPOULOS made the following material false statements and material omissions to the FBI:
                            ...
                            b.
                            Defendant PAPADOPOULOS further told the investigating agents that the professor was "a nothing" and "just a guy talk[ing] up connections or something." In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS understood that the professor had substantial connections to Russian government officials (and had met with some ofthose officials in Moscow immediately prior to telling defendant PAPADOPOULOS about the "thousands of emails") and, over a period of months, defendant PAPADOPOULOS repeatedly sought to use the professor's Russian connections in an effort to arrange a meeting between the Campaign and Russian government officials

                            c.
                            Defendant PAPADOPOULOS claimed he met a certain female Russian national before he joined the Campaign and that their communications consisted of emails such as, '"Hi , how are you?"' In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS met the female Russian national on or about March 24, 2016, after he had become an adviser to the Campaign; he believed that she had connections to Russian government officials; and he sought to use her Russian connections over a period of months in an effort to arrange a meeting between the Campaign and Russian government officials.


                            He was indicted for making false statements to the FBI about attempts to arrange meetings between the Trump campaign and Russian government officials.
                            Yes. I suspect what MM is getting at here is that Papadopoulos appears to have been working independently (so, not actually directed by the campaign) and that meeting with foreign government officials is not equivalent to colluding (though meeting obviously enables collusion); further, he was not actually successful in arranging a meeting, so... no collusion.
                            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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                            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Ignorant Roy View Post
                              He was indicted for making false statements to the FBI about attempts to arrange meetings between the Trump campaign and Russian government officials.
                              Papadopoulos was indicted for making false statements to the FBI. Period. What those false statements happened to be about is irrelevant because he wasn't charged with anything other than making a false statement. He wasn't charged with a campaign crime. He wasn't charged with criminal conspiracy. He wasn't charged with any sort of espionage crimes. He was charged with a nothing-burger process crime for which he was given the lightest of sentences despite Dirty Cop Mueller wanting to throw the book at him.

                              To put it another way, his only "crime" was not telling Mueller's goon squad what they wanted to hear.
                              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                              Than a fool in the eyes of God


                              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                                Yes. I suspect what MM is getting at here is that Papadopoulos appears to have been working independently (so, not actually directed by the campaign) and that meeting with foreign government officials is not equivalent to colluding (though meeting obviously enables collusion); further, he was not actually successful in arranging a meeting, so... no collusion.
                                Not quite. Look at what he was actually charged with. Or more to the point, look at what he wasn't charged with.
                                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                                Comment

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