Voter ID Redux

[Cow Poke]

Which brings us to the dissent and Terra's point: the timing. Happening within weeks of an upcoming election creates an enormous opportunity for disenfranchisement. ....

So ya FINALLY got to the issue!

And the 911 addressing guy says it takes less than an hour to obtain their required address information. But I agree that there should have been a window of time to allow this to happen.

I just wish I hadn't had to spend so much time going through your cited misinformation.

[Cow Poke]

Carpe - I was reading through my posts and realize they could sound a lot more adversarial than I intend.

You are by far my favorite pinko commie leftist! (I poke at you because I enjoy having you around, and you make me think)

When I call you names, I TRY to make it obvious that it's dumb "in fun" silliness, but it may not be coming across that way.

I've been going through a bunch of personal stuff that has... how we say... the bovine fecal material has come forcefully into contact with the air circulation device, and I'm having to deal with family stuff.

This thread just seems like you picked an opinion piece that was very poorly written, and was simply an attack on Republicans. (I keep having to remind myself that I'm not even one of them, yet I have the same frustration with the leftist extremists who seem to have overtaken the Democratic Party)

You are a very refreshing 'opponent' compared to what we normally face here, and I'm glad you're around. Like I said - you make me think.

[Terraceth]

I would grant the application to vacate the Eighth Circuit’s stay because last-minute “[c]ourt orders affecting elections, especially conflicting orders, can themselves result in voter confusion and consequent incentive to remain away from the polls.” Purcell v. Gonzalez, 549 U. S. 1, 4–5 (2006) (per curiam). The risk of voter confusion appears severe here because the injunction against requiring residential-address identification was in force during the primary election and because the Secretary of State’s website announced for months the ID requirements as they existed under that injunction. Reasonable voters may well assume that the IDs allowing them to vote in the primary election would remain valid in the general election. If the Eighth Circuit’s stay is not vacated, the risk of disfranchisement is large. The Eighth Circuit observed that voters have a month to “adapt” to the new regime. But that observation overlooks specific factfindings by the District Court: (1) 70,000 North Dakota residents—almost 20% of the turnout in a regular quadrennial election—lack a qualifying ID; and (2) approximately 18,000 North Dakota residents also lack supplemental documentation sufficient to permit them to vote without a qualifying ID. Although the unchallenged portion of the injunction permitting the use of more informal supplemental documents somewhat lessens this concern, that relief, by itself, scarcely cures the problem given the all too real risk of grand-scale voter confusion. True, an order by this Court vacating the stay would be yet another decision that disrupts the status quo as the election draws ever closer. But the confusion arising from vacating the stay would at most lead to voters securing an additional form of ID. That inconvenience pales in comparison to the confusion caused by the Eighth Circuit’s order, which may lead to voters finding out at the polling place that they cannot vote because their formerly valid ID is now insufficient.

Emphasis mine. As best I can tell from the reports - the supplemental documentation missing is the absence of that proper street address. They have utility bills - but the utility bills have P.O. Boxes on them - not street addresses. The USPS does not deliver in many of these regions, so the people have P.O. Boxes.

Except as is clear from the context in the dissent, the reference to them lacking the qualifying ID refers to them lacking it presently (and that they could, before the election, get said ID), not that it's impossible for them to get it, as was the apparent contention you were making.

This is most clearly shown by the final line: "That inconvenience pales in comparison to the confusion caused by the Eighth Circuit’s order, which may lead to voters finding out at the polling place that they cannot vote because their formerly valid ID is now insufficient." If there was an issue of impossibility, it wouldn't refer to voter confusion, but inability to procure the necessary document(s) at all.

[Mountain Man]

Carpe - I was reading through my posts and realize they could sound a lot more adversarial than I intend.

You are by far my favorite pinko commie leftist! (I poke at you because I enjoy having you around, and you make me think)

When I call you names, I TRY to make it obvious that it's dumb "in fun" silliness, but it may not be coming across that way.

I've been going through a bunch of personal stuff that has... how we say... the bovine fecal material has come forcefully into contact with the air circulation device, and I'm having to deal with family stuff.

This thread just seems like you picked an opinion piece that was very poorly written, and was simply an attack on Republicans. (I keep having to remind myself that I'm not even one of them, yet I have the same frustration with the leftist extremists who seem to have overtaken the Democratic Party)

You are a very refreshing 'opponent' compared to what we normally face here, and I'm glad you're around. Like I said - you make me think.

There's a reason I haven't tried to come up with a clever play on carpe's username. I do like and respect him even though there are times I want to wring his neck (rhetorically speaking).

[Sparko]

So how does the electric company know where to hook up services. Most people in rural areas don’t have PO Boxes - the have Rural Route boxes, like my grandpa had and they are linked to a physical location- do you have any evidence of your claims or are you just repeating what you were told?

[rogue06]

Food for thought:

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[Cow Poke]

Except as is clear from the context in the dissent, the reference to them lacking the qualifying ID refers to them lacking it presently (and that they could, before the election, get said ID), not that it's impossible for them to get it, as was the apparent contention you were making.

Exactly - and this isn't something new - 911 Addressing has been going on for several years in this area, and the controversy over addresses didn't just spring up overnight. Also, they could get their 911 Address within an hour or so.

[Cow Poke]

So how does the electric company know where to hook up services. Most people in rural areas don’t have PO Boxes - the have Rural Route boxes, like my grandpa had and they are linked to a physical location- do you have any evidence of your claims or are you just repeating what you were told?

Now, for those city slickers who don't know what a "Rural Route" is --- like "Route 4 box 78" -- It's a route (just like a paper route) that includes whatever streets, roads or highways are within the region or territory or geographic area it serves. We have bunches of these in Texas. There is no "street address", but the "Route 4 box 78" is, indeed, a "residential address" like what would be allowed on the SoS ND website.

[JimL]

Hmm...I'm not ready to go out on that limb. Just because something disproportionately impacts one group or another does not mean that group is being targeted. If the "exact match" criteria is law, then the process is mandated by law.

It's mandated by Georgia law because Kemp is in control of voter registration and devised the law in order to suppress the vote against himself. He basically fornulated the same law in 2016 and it was shot down by the court and now, for his own election, he is reviving, basically the same law.

If there is a procedure for permitting these people to vote, then they are safe (and that appears to be the case).

And there is, but if those who have been purged from the rolls because the registrar forgot to add a period or a comma when registering them, don't know that they were purged, then it doesn't matter if there is a procedure to remedy the problem.

For me to go out on this limb, someone would have to show that there is a high incidence of "exact match" being overlooked for Republican or white voters, and I see nothing that suggests this.

That's exactly the case, more than 70% of those purged from the rolls, were African Americans.

Personally, I think it's bad form to have a candidate in a position to impact voter registration when that registration can impact the outcome of the election. I think the candidate should recuse themselves or resign, simply because of the perception and the undermining of public trust.

Ya think?

But I see no reason here to accuse them of malfeasance. Poor judgement related to public perception, maybe. But not fraud or racism or partisanship.

I think that you're trying too hard to show yourself as being unbiased carpe. This guy, as well as Georgia in general, has a history of voter suppression, and this is an obvious case of it.

[Bill the Cat]

And the current utility bill will likely have a P.O. Box -

Wrong. Utility bills are required by law to have the physical service address where the meter is located on the bill, not just the owner's mailing address.