Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

We Must Stop Global Warming NOW!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
    The joys of capitalism. If your job becomes value less, you're out of job, and you get to seek for employment elsewhere.

    Tell that to the residents of grande Cache and Hanna and other small towns in Alberta who have had their coal mines shut down by the communist NDP government over the last year. No other industry in their areas, sweet pea. Where are they supposed to get work?
    Last edited by mossrose; 10-17-2018, 09:48 AM.


    Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by mossrose View Post
      I don't believe that. Show me statistics.
      Look at my links above, mossy.
      Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

      Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
      sigpic
      I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
        Look at my links above, mossy.

        I saw yours. I want Leonhard to show me where he gets his stats.


        Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by firstfloor View Post
          Scottish Power says today that it has sold off all its gas and coal power stations and is generating 100% wind power. The first power company in the UK to do that. That’s the direction of travel and things are moving quicker all the time.
          Are they using bag pipes to generate the wind? or politicians?


          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
            1) Wind turbines, thus far, account for a very small percentage of electricity generation; increase that percentage, and more birds will be killed.
            2) Wind turbines disproportionately kill large, rare birds, who are too big to be attacked by cats.
            3) You are exaggerating (figures for cats are all over the place, from 10 to 1 to 10,000 to 1).
            4) Cats kill birds in order to eat them, not for no purpose.
            1) True. It was 10000 times more not 1000000 times more. Though even if we increase the number of wind turbines in the US by a 100 fold, we wouldn't see those numbers flip.
            2) That is a real issue, and care should be taken on where the wind turbines are built. I wish more studies were done on that problem.
            3) In a situation like that I'd do the conservative estimate and take the median.
            4) That is besides the point, if we're judging whether wind turbines are an existential threat to birds.
            Last edited by Leonhard; 10-17-2018, 10:45 AM.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by mossrose View Post
              I don't believe that. Show me statistics.
              I was a bit off, but it is true. Cats kill somewhere up around a billion birds per year. Wind turbines somewhere in the neighborhood of a hundred thousand.

              https://www.fws.gov/birds/bird-enthu...s-to-birds.php

              This is taken from the US Fish and Wildlife Service. Also cars kill a thousand times as many birds as wind turbines. Oil pits kill ten times as many birds. Collissions with tall building in genera, that have glass facades, account for nearly a billion as well.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by mossrose View Post
                Tell that to the residents of grande Cache and Hanna and other small towns in Alberta who have had their coal mines shut down by the communist NDP government over the last year. No other industry in their areas, sweet pea. Where are they supposed to get work?
                You can ask Sparko. He pulled himself up by his straps. Moved elsewhere. Learned to program, and got employed. Personally I do wish the government did more to help people transition between jobs.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                  That's a question for environmentalists. They're the ones who keep trying to "save" the planet with schemes like giant windmills that kill hundreds of thousands of flying wildlife a year,
                  True, but its not that simple, as fossil fueled powerplants kill more birds per Gwh than wind power does. https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...01421509001074



                  I'm personally mostly for transitioning to nuclear power, though its hard to get permissions for that. If I lived in the US I'd vote conservative if they'd be willing to cut the red tape on building more nuclear power stations, and I'm not even kidding.

                  I really don't like those solar towers. They look awesome, but they're an engineering nightmare. Not worth the trouble. Flat photovoltaic cells are a lot better, and don't focus light like that.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                    True, but its not that simple, as fossil fueled powerplants kill more birds per Gwh than wind power does. https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...01421509001074

                    Not really a meaningful statistic when you consider that there are considerably more fossil fuel power plants than wind farms. This is like vilifying automobiles because they kill more people than horse-drawn carriages. I mean, of course they do.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      Just because the Bible doesn't mention beer in Heaven doesn't mean there isn't any.
                      But it's true, there's no coffee there either. God revealed it to me.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by JimL View Post
                        But it's true, there's no coffee there either. God revealed it to me.
                        No coffee!?

                        Insert "Hebrews" joke here.
                        I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                          Not really a meaningful statistic when you consider that there are considerably more fossil fuel power plants than wind farms. This is like vilifying automobiles because they kill more people than horse-drawn carriages. I mean, of course they do.
                          If you'd just read the graph, you'd see it says "Avian Deaths / GWh", so its already adjusted for the fact that coal power dominates the energy production.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                            You can ask Sparko. He pulled himself up by his straps. Moved elsewhere. Learned to program, and got employed. Personally I do wish the government did more to help people transition between jobs.
                            Sparky is one person. This is whole towns. And why should the government put more burden on the taxpayers when they take away valid jobs from people? Those who've lost their jobs will end up on unemployment adding already to the burden of taxpayers. What else should the government do?

                            All for a bunch of bull crap called AGW.


                            Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                              You can ask Sparko. He pulled himself up by his straps. Moved elsewhere. Learned to program, and got employed. Personally I do wish the government did more to help people transition between jobs.
                              sure did. but I was young and still making my life choices. many of my family didn't have that choice. The mines shut down, they had roots and farms going back hundreds of years. They couldn't just pull out and leave. and who would even buy their land in a place where there is no longer a viable town or any business, except maybe strip miners but they can't because the coal mines are shut down. no coal miners means that the towns that support them dry up too. A lot of people end up on welfare or disability and live off the government because they have no other choice. So it ends up costing the country even more money.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by mossrose View Post
                                Sparky is one person. This is whole towns. And why should the government put more burden on the taxpayers when they take away valid jobs from people? Those who've lost their jobs will end up on unemployment adding already to the burden of taxpayers. What else should the government do?
                                Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                                sure did. but I was young and still making my life choices. many of my family didn't have that choice. The mines shut down, they had roots and farms going back hundreds of years. They couldn't just pull out and leave. and who would even buy their land in a place where there is no longer a viable town or any business, except maybe strip miners but they can't because the coal mines are shut down. no coal miners means that the towns that support them dry up too. A lot of people end up on welfare or disability and live off the government because they have no other choice. So it ends up costing the country even more money.
                                Sparko is pretty cool. And I agree not everyone will have the means or motivations to do that.

                                As for what governments can do, its you guys who keep telling me that the government don't owe anything to nobody. The closing of coal mines has led to tragedy for a lot of workers. Don't think I don't understand that. I do. But it was inevitable.

                                Natural gas has become a cost-effective competitor to coal, with significantly less pollution occuring. Coal power plants are rather nasty, and the sludge they leave behind is toxic (and even slightly radioactive). There was a recent spillage of it into a lake, which killed all life in it for miles and miles. Obama's administration put in regulations to tighten up how bassins storing fly ash sludge. Scott Pruit rolled those back because... I guess conservatives are pro-pollution. Really I don't understand that one.

                                And now you got Trump, and Trump appointed the most anti-regulation person he could find, Scott Pruitt, who largely told the EPA to not mention climate change anymore, and roll back Obama-era regolutions. And for a short while there was a tiny little jump in coal. But its not going to ever come back to the level it was around the turn of the millenium when coal supplied more than half of the energy of the US.

                                Any promises that this would happen are empty. Coal would have gone the way of burning peat anyway.

                                I'm more curious as to why the coal workers didn't anticipate that. See the end coming in a few decades and work towards developing new industries. Even the Arabs know that they won't have the oil as a source of income forever, and are slowly building up an industry.

                                Did they really think that they would be pulling coal out of the ground until the end of time?
                                Last edited by Leonhard; 10-17-2018, 01:46 PM.

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by whag, Yesterday, 05:11 PM
                                0 responses
                                19 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post whag
                                by whag
                                 
                                Started by Cow Poke, Yesterday, 11:25 AM
                                32 responses
                                192 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post oxmixmudd  
                                Started by whag, 03-17-2024, 01:48 PM
                                24 responses
                                104 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post whag
                                by whag
                                 
                                Started by CivilDiscourse, 03-17-2024, 11:56 AM
                                52 responses
                                275 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post seer
                                by seer
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-16-2024, 07:40 AM
                                77 responses
                                383 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Hypatia_Alexandria  
                                Working...
                                X