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orthodox Christians only.

Discussion on matters of general mainstream evangelical Christian theology that do not fit within Theology 201. Have some spiritual gifts ceased today? Is the KJV the only viable translation for the church today? In what sense are the books of the bible inspired and what are those books? Church government? Modern day prophets and apostles?

This forum is primarily for Christians to discuss matters of Christian doctrine, and is not the area for debate between atheists (or those opposing orthodox Christianity) and Christians. Inquiring atheists (or sincere seekers/doubters/unorthodox) seeking only Christian participation and having demonstrated a manner that does not seek to undermine the orthodox Christian faith of others are also welcome, but must seek Moderator permission first. When defining “Christian” or "orthodox" for purposes of this section, we mean persons holding to the core essentials of the historic Christian faith such as the Trinity, the Creatorship of God, the virgin birth, the bodily resurrection of Christ, the atonement, the future bodily return of Christ, the future bodily resurrection of the just and the unjust, and the final judgment. Persons not holding to these core doctrines are welcome to participate in the Comparative Religions section without restriction, in Theology 201 as regards to the nature of God and salvation with limited restrictions, and in Christology for issues surrounding the person of Christ and the Trinity. Atheists are welcome to discuss and debate these issues in the Apologetics 301 forum without such restrictions.

Additionally and rarely, there may be some topics or lines of discussion that within the Moderator's discretion fall so outside the bounds of mainstream orthodox doctrine (in general Christian circles or in the TheologyWeb community) or that deny certain core values that are the Christian convictions of forum leadership that may be more appropriately placed within Unorthodox Theology 201. NO personal offense should be taken by such discretionary decision for none is intended. While inerrancy is NOT considered a requirement for posting in this section, a general respect for the Bible text and a respect for the inerrantist position of others is requested.

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  • Theology Web

    Some people's bookshelves are filled with all sorts of theological writings, yet they have never read the entire bible. They got caught up in the theology web of pedanticism and speculation. I am of the persuasion that those who are well versed in the bible -- those who simply read the bible -- have enough wisdom and insight to refrain from entertaining verbose theological writings, debates on predestination, eschatology, God's existence, etc. When it's all said and done we cannot even prove the basics of the Christian faith for the most part. I think it's important to keep that perspective.

    There is a time and place to contend for the faith but we are not first century Christian's living in their context. As Christian's we believe the bible is inspired but it's also wonderfully ancient and primitive -- ditto for it's context and human authors. Indulging in theology and apologetics won't provide much insight beyond what the bible has already provided. The next God debate won't provide you with anymore certainty, the next N. T. Wright book will lead to the next N. T. Wright book. Isn't there much wisdom in simply reading our bibles as we live in faith, hope, and love -- wherever that leads us?

    Keep
    It
    Simple
    Saint

  • #2
    A lot of books help explain the context and society from which the Bible emerged and therefore can lead to a deeper and richer understanding of the text.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
      A lot of books help explain the context and society from which the Bible emerged and therefore can lead to a deeper and richer understanding of the text.
      Exactly! And furthermore, it's important to know what it meant to the original audience. As Gordon D. Fee says in "How To Read The Bible For All It's Worth"

      “A text cannot mean what it could never have meant for its original readers/hearers.”

      And
      “Whether one likes it or not, every reader is at the same time an interpreter. That is, most of us assume as we read that we also understand what we read. We also tend to think that our understanding is the same thing as the Holy Spirit’s or human author’s intent. However, we invariably bring to the text all that we are, with all of our experiences, culture, and prior understandings of words and ideas. Sometimes what we bring to the text, unintentionally to be sure, leads us astray, or else causes us to read all kinds of foreign ideas into the text.”
      "What has the Church gained if it is popular, but there is no conviction, no repentance, no power?" - A.W. Tozer

      "... there are two parties in Washington, the stupid party and the evil party, who occasionally get together and do something both stupid and evil, and this is called bipartisanship." - Everett Dirksen

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        A lot of books help explain the context and society from which the Bible emerged and therefore can lead to a deeper and richer understanding of the text.
        Fair enough, and I don't dispute that, but I think we should be thoroughly familiar with the text of the bible -- having read the entire thing at least twice IMO -- before we undertake the often hazy process of contextualization.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Littlejoe View Post
          Exactly! And furthermore, it's important to know what it meant to the original audience. As Gordon D. Fee says in "How To Read The Bible For All It's Worth"

          “A text cannot mean what it could never have meant for its original readers/hearers.”

          And
          “Whether one likes it or not, every reader is at the same time an interpreter. That is, most of us assume as we read that we also understand what we read. We also tend to think that our understanding is the same thing as the Holy Spirit’s or human author’s intent. However, we invariably bring to the text all that we are, with all of our experiences, culture, and prior understandings of words and ideas. Sometimes what we bring to the text, unintentionally to be sure, leads us astray, or else causes us to read all kinds of foreign ideas into the text.”
          And yet informed interpretations abound. Uncertainty abounds. Mystery abounds. I say read the bible. Then read it again. Do what you will after that.

          Comment


          • #6
            I'm on my 27th read of the Bible
            I have a room full of books, some of which I read.

            Can I go to Heaven?
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
              I'm on my 27th read of the Bible
              Love.

              I have a room full of books
              Love.

              some of which I read.
              Wise.

              Can I go to Heaven?
              You've got my vote.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Scrawly View Post
                Love.



                Love.



                Wise.



                You've got my vote.
                I fee so much better.
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Scrawly View Post
                  My positions are unsupportable, and I know it.
                  Fixed that for you. Sheesh.
                  Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                  Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                  sigpic
                  I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    I'm on my 27th read of the Bible
                    I have a room full of books, some of which I read.

                    Can I go to Heaven?
                    I've read it cover to cover (including all the begats which is where many people stall or just skim) somewhere around 7 or 8 times at least although it has been over a decade since I've done so. I've started doing it in response to a Bible study class that insisted that we read a few verses from the different books in it and discuss them which seemed to me like taking things out of context in a mix and match sort of way. That and my grandmother kind of inspired me to do it as she tried to read at least a chapter a night before going to sleep. Sometimes when she was real sleepy she'd only make it through a few verses though she'd still at least read some of it every night.
                    Last edited by rogue06; 12-03-2018, 05:32 AM.

                    I'm always still in trouble again

                    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                      I've read it cover to cover (including all the begats which is where many people stall or just skim) somewhere around 7 or 8 times at least although it has been over a decade since I've done so. I've started doing it in response to a Bible study class that insisted that we read a few verses from the different books in it and discuss them which seemed to me like taking things out of context in a mix and match sort of way. That and my grandmother kind of inspired me to do it as she tried to read at least a chapter a night before going to sleep. Sometimes when she was real sleepy she'd only make it through a few verses though she'd still at least read some of it every night.
                      I have a confession to make.

                      Sometimes (OK, maybe usually) I skip the begats.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                        I've read it cover to cover (including all the begats which is where many people stall or just skim) ...
                        OK, so I'll throw in my Proverbs reading plan.

                        In ADDITION to whatever Bible Reading program you may be utilizing, I like to add one chapter from Proverbs - whatever chapter the day of the month happens to be.

                        Today is the 3rd, so I read Proverbs 3.

                        I like this program, because if you forget, or skip for a while, you just look at the calendar and whatever day of the month it is, that's where you pick up.

                        (Yeah, I know, you don't always get to the end every month)
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          I'm on my 27th read of the Bible
                          I have a room full of books, some of which I read.

                          Can I go to Heaven?
                          For the lurker who may not detect the intended sarcasm, and because this is a crucially important point, I want to be clear that "reading the Bible" or "having" or "reading books" is not necessary for "going to Heaven".

                          It is only through acceptance of Jesus Christ as savior that we have hope in Eternity.
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            I have a confession to make.

                            Sometimes (OK, maybe usually) I skip the begats.
                            You do have to plow through them and not let your eyes glaze over.

                            I'm always still in trouble again

                            "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                            "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                            "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                              For the lurker who may not detect the intended sarcasm, and because this is a crucially important point, I want to be clear that "reading the Bible" or "having" or "reading books" is not necessary for "going to Heaven".

                              It is only through acceptance of Jesus Christ as savior that we have hope in Eternity.
                              To quote somebody I love and trust: "EGGzactly!"

                              I'm always still in trouble again

                              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                              Comment

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