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Mueller investigation conludes that Trump is guilty!

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  • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    That is silly. I'm simply responding to the facts as they are. Half the country is concerned about this. It isn't 'just me', and it isn't irrational. What is perhaps irrational is the continued dismissal of the continuous stream of red flags trump is throwing out way. It may be rational to trust and hope the founding fathers created a sufficiently strong set of restraints to keep him under control, but it is not rational to look the other way so often as you do.
    This is becoming hilarious.

    You're sounding like a guy in an empty room insisting to all of his invisible friends that he's really not crazy.

    "You guys believe me, doncha? Ya gotta believe me!"

    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      it's irrational to believe Trump is trying to undermine democracy itself and the only thing reigning him in is the constitution.
      The only thing reigning him in is the very democratic institutions that he has been trying to undermine in the minds of the people, like his supporters here on tweb of course.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
        The only thing reigning him in is the very democratic institutions that he has been trying to undermine in the minds of the people, like his supporters here on tweb of course.
        No Jim. Trump actually has a great deal of respect for the Constitution and America. The only ones trying to undermine the constitution are you liberals. Got the 2nd amendment repealed yet?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
          Name one of the items I listed about Trump that is not true and verifiable:

          Here is the list:

          He does not respect the rule of law,He finds it very inconvenient that he can't just do what he wants. :

          We see this almost every day. Tillerson just recently discussed that one of the most difficult parts of his interaction with trump was constantly having to tell him "You can't do that, it is illegal". Cohen - in jail for 3 years in part because he did the illegal things on Trump told hi to do. Trump consistently berated Sessions over his attempt to respect the law and recuse himself due to a conflict of interest. He tried to get Comey to look the other way on the matter of Flynn, another man in trouble with the department of Justice etc ...

          He does not understand the purpose or need for a free press.

          Wow, this would fill the entire post. Supporting MBS in spite of his involvement with the killing of Khoshoggi. His constant characterization of the press as the 'enemy of the people'. His disdain for and open hostility to any reporter who does not report favorably about his plans and inititiatives, to the point of taking punitive action or resorting to public shaming etc ..

          He is incredibly vengeful and knows little about the concept of self-restraint.

          Lawsuits, multiple affairs, "Access Hollywood", numerous instances of public shaming over twitter, etc ...

          He has almost no moral filter.

          See above. His constant and incessant lying, even when there is no need! His use of Cohen as a 'fixer' and others. etc ...

          He has self-identified with numerous despots, speaking out loud praise for their approach and envying the 'respect' their subjects show them.

          Trump is nothing but a bully. From how he has dealt with Ford in his public shaming of her at rallies to Sessions to Tillerson to his numerous lawsuits over trivial matters. He has the personality for sure. But
          specifically these 7 one way or the other he has deferred to or out and out declared admiration for:

          Kim Jong Un, Duterte, Putin, Xi Jinping, Abdel-Fattah el-Sissi, Erdogan, MBS.


          But feel free to show how he is NOT the things I listed, or better yet, make a cogent argument for how we can 'trust' a man with those characteristics NOT to seek something like emperor for life when the entire structure of our government is oriented around regonizing that even relatively normal, seemingly good people when embued with power are subject to the same desire and temptation. How much more so Donald Trump!



          Jim
          So you’ve brought a list of opinion and hysterics to pretty much prove you can’t be reasonable when it comes to Trump. I’ve seen similar list with Obama too.
          "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
          GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

          Comment


          • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
            That is silly. I'm simply responding to the facts as they are. Half the country is concerned about this. It isn't 'just me', and it isn't irrational. What is perhaps irrational is the continued dismissal of the continuous stream of red flags trump is throwing out way. It may be rational to trust and hope the founding fathers created a sufficiently strong set of restraints to keep him under control, but it is not rational to look the other way so often as you do.

            Jim
            And the same can be said about Obama, Bush, Clinton, Regan, etc. Youre just proving that half the country is sore losers that can’t stand the fact their Queen wasn’t voted in.
            "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
            GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
              Everything you mention is taken out of context and an exaggeration Jim. wow. I tell you you are being over the top and you double down on it.
              I don't think I'm being over the top. I think you are being overly optimistic to the point of naivete. The wisdom of the founding fathers in setting our government up the way they have may well protect us, but Trump is EXACTLY the sort of fellow they were trying to protect us from.


              "doesn't respect the rule of law" - if he doesn't know something is against the law that is not the same as not respecting it. He isn't a lawyer like most politicians are.
              Yikes. What about when he is told its against the law and he throws a fit and is so angry at the fellow telling him its against the law he eventually fires him? (e.g. Tillerson, Sessions, Kelly) Who else in office does that??

              No moral filter - I agree with that one
              YAY!

              Identified with numerous despots. No he hasn't. He dealt with them and actually got them to back down. Like Korea. That's diplomacy, not identifying with them.
              Please. Admiring how Kim Jong Un's people bow to him and treat him with respect? (yeah - if they don't they are dead!), or praising Duterte's approach to drug control (just kill 'em all!) Do you not ever read the news?


              Bully? Sometimes he is, but not always. He mostly just doesn't let anyone walk all over him. And he doesn't respond like the liberals want him to. They are used to people backing down and apologizing when they make accusations of victimization and racism and such, Trump doesn't back down and tells them what slimeballs they are.
              no Sparko. He is the definition of abusive. Have you not observed how he treated Sessions for recusing himself? How he publically shamed Ford, or the young freshman that challenged him at a town meeting. Or Cecelia Vega, or Ted Cruz's wife. And the list goes on and on and on. The man is a Bully, always has been.

              He understands the press pretty well and again doesn't let them push him around. Trump know how to push their buttons and with a single tweet can get them riled up for days.
              Congratulations. You've officially bought into admiring a bully in action. And that is a very, very long way from the Sermon on the Mount. Trump isn't 'tough', he's a bully. He only trashes those he thinks are weaker than him. Proof. Watch him cower before Putin next time they are together.


              Jim
              My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

              If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

              This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                No Jim. Trump actually has a great deal of respect for the Constitution and America. The only ones trying to undermine the constitution are you liberals. Got the 2nd amendment repealed yet?
                No, that's just the willfully blind postition that avid Trump supporters take. They can't admit to themselves that in Trumps first 2 years he has shown nothing but contempt and a lack of respect for the Constitution. From his firing of Comey for not "letting the Flynn thing go", to his constant lying to the american people, his abuse of the emoluments clause, his attacking the integrity of judges who rule against him, his calling the free press the "enemy of the people," his encouragement of police misconduct, to his lies concerning the previous administration and the accussations of a Deep State, not to mention his verbalized belief that the purpose of an Atty. General is to protect him.
                The guy has no respect whatsoever for the Constitution or the law in general, and he never has had, he's a crook and a wannabe dictator, pure and simple.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
                  He does not understand the purpose or need for a free press.

                  Wow, this would fill the entire post. Supporting MBS in spite of his involvement with the killing of Khoshoggi. His constant characterization of the press as the 'enemy of the people'. His disdain for and open hostility to any reporter who does not report favorably about his plans and inititiatives, to the point of taking punitive action or resorting to public shaming etc ..
                  I've seen these sorts of complaints about Trump a lot, but they are confusing to me. Has Trump complained a lot about or insulted various news sources? Sure, but that's allowed by the exact same right that allows those news sources to print the stories he complains about. But has he actually attempted to curb the legal rights of the free press?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
                    But has he actually attempted to curb the legal rights of the free press?
                    Nope. That was more Obama's thing.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Terraceth View Post
                      I've seen these sorts of complaints about Trump a lot, but they are confusing to me. Has Trump complained a lot about or insulted various news sources? Sure, but that's allowed by the exact same right that allows those news sources to print the stories he complains about. But has he actually attempted to curb the legal rights of the free press?
                      Of course the attempt to discredit the legitimacy of the free press is allowed, as well as it is allowed to discredit all other democratic institutions, but that doesn't make it right. Trump is the President of these United States, a democracy whose very existence as a democracy is dependent upon these institutions, including a free press, without the which you can kiss your own freedom goodby. The Presidents purpose is to uphold these institutions, not to tear them down in order to enhance his own power. Stage one for a wannabe dictator is to discredit the legitimacy of the free press, and that is what Trump has been working on for the last two years. Hitler did the same, he called it the lugenpresse, or like Trump, the lying press. Only after drilling it into the heads of the hoi polloi was he able to take over the press completely and turn it into his own propaganda machine run by Goebbels. Like every aspect of Fascism, it doesn't just happen overnight, there is a process, and Trump has shown these last two years that he has studied the process. There is an old saying, I'm sure you've all heard it: "When you forget history, you are doomed to repeat it."
                      Last edited by JimL; 12-13-2018, 07:31 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                        [ATTACH=CONFIG]33755[/ATTACH]
                        Gotta love your statistically based, scientific diagram.
                        “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
                          20-40% of that almost 50% where anti-hillary votes, not pro-trump votes.
                          They were also "Screw the libiots and Swamp" votes. One of the things that broke my ambivalence and caused me to vote Trump instead of abstaining was that I saw the way he drove all the right people totally hair-on-fire blood-from-the-ears foaming-at-both-ends crazy.


                          Many of those were anti-Trump votes because of the rock and a hard place position that the election was. When I speak of 'stumbling blocks' seer, I am speaking of the SUPPORT for trump by evangelicals over policies and actions CONTRARY to our faith both before and ESPECIALLY after the election. I am not talking about the rock and a hard place choice that the election itself presented.
                          What "policies and actions contrary to our faith" has Trump put in place that any "normal" conservative Republican would not have at least attempted to put in place?
                          Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                          Beige Federalist.

                          Nationalist Christian.

                          "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                          Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                          Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                          Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                          Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                          Justice for Matthew Perna!

                          Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                            No, that's just the willfully blind postition that avid Trump supporters take. They can't admit to themselves that in Trumps first 2 years he has shown nothing but contempt and a lack of respect for the Constitution. From his firing of Comey for not "letting the Flynn thing go", to his constant lying to the american people, his abuse of the emoluments clause, his attacking the integrity of judges who rule against him, his calling the free press the "enemy of the people," his encouragement of police misconduct, to his lies concerning the previous administration and the accussations of a Deep State, not to mention his verbalized belief that the purpose of an Atty. General is to protect him.
                            The guy has no respect whatsoever for the Constitution or the law in general, and he never has had, he's a crook and a wannabe dictator, pure and simple.
                            so have you repealed the 2nd yet? You were arguing for that. And yet you are upset because you think Trump wants to circumvent the constitution? He has never tried anything like that.

                            Comment


                            • I love how liberals try to wrap themselves in the constitution and claim Trump is trying to destroy it, when it is them trying to remove our rights all along. Hypocrites.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                                Gotta love your statistically based, scientific diagram.
                                It's definitely scientific:
                                transit.jpg
                                Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                                MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                                MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                                seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

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