new report on Russian meddling ...

[JimL]

No. If you actually read the link, they showed that it doesn't even really do that. Our best estimate of the direct effects of campaign contact on Americans’ candidate choices in general elections is essentially zero,”

Which only means that there is no way to know witha any certainty what effect the Russian interference had on people, or how or why people voted the way they did. But we do know the intent, i.e. to get your guy elected. The Russian's themselves were pretty convinced that their tactics were what ultimately got their/your guy elected.

[oxmixmudd]

She DID work (unsuccessfully) to keep him from getting re-elected. It's not exactly a stretch to imagine that Putin might return the favor.

I'm sure that was a motivation. The point of this thread is to counter MM's assertion in a previous thread (and this one) that there is no evidence the Russians were working to get Trump elected. Whatever the state of the evidence before, this report makes it clear they WERE working to help trump get elected.

I did not post the reference to this report to say anything about why the Russians worked to get trump elected.

I did not post the reference to this report to shed any light on how much if any Trump or his campaign were involved in encouraging Putin or working with Putin.

This thread is about refuting the idea we don't have enough evidence to say the Russians were working to help get Trump elected. They were.

Jim

[oxmixmudd]

She DID work (unsuccessfully) to keep him from getting re-elected. It's not exactly a stretch to imagine that Putin might return the favor.

I'm sure that was a motivation. The point of this thread is to counter MM's assertion in a previous thread (and this one) that there is no evidence the Russians were working to get Trump elected. Whatever the state of the evidence before, this report makes it clear they WERE working to help trump get elected.

I did not post the reference to this report to say anything about why the Russians worked to get trump elected.

I did not post the reference to this report to try to establish how effective or ineffective their efforts were.

I did not post the reference to this report to shed any light on how much if any Trump or his campaign were involved in encouraging Putin or working with Putin.

This thread is about refuting the idea we don't have enough evidence to say the Russians were working to help get Trump elected. They were.

Jim

[JimL]

She DID work (unsuccessfully) to keep him from getting re-elected. It's not exactly a stretch to imagine that Putin might return the favor.

Really? How did she go about that OBP?

[Bill the Cat]

Which only means that there is no way to know witha any certainty what effect the Russian interference had on people, or how or why people voted the way they did. But we do know the intent, i.e. to get your guy elected. The Russian's themselves were pretty convinced that their tactics were what ultimately got their/your guy elected.

*Language alert...

Source: https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1074833714931224582

If you wrote out a list of the most important factors in the 2016 election, I'm not sure that Russian social media memes would be among the top 100. The scale was quite small and there's not much evidence that they were effective.

© Copyright Original Source

[Mountain Man]

*Language alert...

Source: https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1074833714931224582

If you wrote out a list of the most important factors in the 2016 election, I'm not sure that Russian social media memes would be among the top 100. The scale was quite small and there's not much evidence that they were effective.

© Copyright Original Source

But... but... they "energized" Trump's base!

[Sparko]

Of course the USA would never, ever try to influence another country's election.

[One Bad Pig]

Really? How did she go about that OBP?

It took a whole Google search to find:

Putin ran for reelection in March 2012.

Source: Washington Post

In December 2011, despite a deepening economic crisis, Putin’s United Russia party retained control of the Duma in parliamentary elections that independent monitoring groups described as fraudulent.

Thousands of Russians took to the streets in protest, and Clinton — with the White House’s explicit blessing — spoke publicly in their defense, condemning Russian officials for manipulating the vote and systematically harassing election observers.

“The Russian people, like people everywhere, deserve the right to have their voices heard and their votes counted,” Clinton said during a speech that month in Lithuania. “And that means they deserve fair, free, transparent elections and leaders who are accountable to them.”

After her speech, when demonstrations in Moscow grew still larger, Putin suggested that his political opponents were following marching orders from Clinton and her team.

© Copyright Original Source

Source: Politico

When mass protests against Russian President Vladimir Putin erupted in Moscow in December 2011, Putin made clear who he thought was really behind them: Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.

With the protesters accusing Putin of having rigged recent elections, the Russian leader pointed an angry finger at Clinton, who had issued a statement sharply critical of the voting results. “She said they were dishonest and unfair,” Putin fumed in public remarks, saying that Clinton gave “a signal” to demonstrators working “with the support of the U.S. State Department” to undermine his power. “We need to safeguard ourselves from this interference in our internal affairs,” Putin declared.

© Copyright Original Source

Source: The Guardian

Vladimir Putin has accused Hillary Clinton, the US secretary of state, of fomenting an increasingly vociferous opposition movement in Russia, threatening to derail the two countries' fragile resetting of relations.

The accusation builds on months of Russian statements and media coverage blaming popular uprisings around the Arab world on western scheming. It comes as Washington and Moscow tussle over a host of disagreements, from missile defence to Syria.

Speaking to supporters on Thursday, Putin accused Clinton of giving "the signal" to opposition leaders, who are expected to gather with tens of thousands of supporters for a protest on Saturday. He rejected Clinton's repeated criticism of a parliamentary vote last weekend that gave Putin's United Russia party nearly 50% of the vote amid widespread reports of fraud.

"[Opposition leaders] heard the signal and with the support of the US state department began active work," Putin said during a meeting of the All-Russia People's Front, a new political movement set up to support his presidential candidacy in a 4 March election.

"We are all grownups here. We all understand the organisers are acting according to a well-known scenario and in their own mercenary political interests," he said.

Clinton raised the issue of Russia's elections again on Thursday during a visit to Brussels. "Human rights is part of who we are," she said, after Putin's comments emerged. "And we expressed concerns that we thought were well founded about the conduct of the elections.

"We are supportive of the rights and aspirations of the Russian people to be able to make progress and realise a better future for themselves."

© Copyright Original Source

Source: NBC News

Several former Obama administration officials said that when Clinton was secretary of state, she was by far the most aggressive and outspoken U.S. official when it came to countering Putin’s efforts to consolidate his power domestically, and to expand his sphere of influence in the region and beyond. And when she left government, they say, Clinton became even more combative, going so far as to liken Putin to Hitler in 2014 for his annexation of part of Ukraine. The remark offended not just Putin but the Russian public.

Clinton was already a critic of Putin during her seven years in the Senate, where she was a member of the Armed Services Committee. In 2008, she made headlines for publicly doubting that then-President George W. Bush had gotten a sense of Putin’s soul because as a former KGB agent he probably didn’t have one.

By the time she became Secretary of State in 2009, U.S-Russia relations were especially tense, given Putin’s invasion of the neighboring Republic of Georgia. The new administration launched a “reset” aimed at improving the bilateral relationship with Clinton as one of its leaders. But from the start she was especially suspicious of Putin, and vocal about it.

© Copyright Original Source

WaPo
Politico
Guardian
NBC

[Sparko]

Whaaaaa? The US interfered in a Russian election? Say it isn't so!

[Mountain Man]

I woke up with no energy on election day and wondered if I would even have the strength to make it to my local polling place to cast my vote, but then I saw this funny meme on Facebook, and it totally energized me. Thanks, Mr. Putin!

[oxmixmudd]

I woke up with no energy on election day and wondered if I would even have the strength to make it to my local polling place to cast my vote, but then I saw this funny meme on Facebook, and it totally energized me. Thanks, Mr. Putin!

You realize you're acting like the brats in my Sunday school from years back - right. Just make fun of what you don't understand or can't quite comprehend.

Jim

[Mountain Man]

You realize you're acting like the brats in my Sunday school from years back - right. Just make fun of what you don't understand or can't quite comprehend.

I hope you realize that my mockery is not based on a lack of understanding.

[oxmixmudd]

I hope you realize that my mockery is not based on a lack of understanding.

O' contrare mon ami! It is rather quite clear you are not comprehending the discussion on that topic.

Jim

[Mountain Man]

It is rather quite clear you are not comprehending the discussion on that topic.

Whatever you need to tell yourself...

[Charles]

O' contrare mon ami! It is rather quite clear you are not comprehending the discussion on that topic.

Jim

I agree. I would not rule out the possibility that he is misunderstanding on purpose, though.