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Thread: Did Jesus preach or proclaim the doctrine of the Trinity?

  1. #131
    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian3 View Post
    [/U][/B]

    First, there is only one God and Christians believe in only one God, the God of Israel.

    The phrase "sitting at the right of hand of God" means a place of honor and authority.
    To be specific, it is an echo of Psalm 110.1:

    “The LORD said to my Lord:
    Sit thou at My right hand,
    Until I make thine enemies thy footstool”.

    The passage is a speech of God to the king He has chosen. And for the New Testament authors, Jesus, the son of David, is that King. And that passage is fulfilled when Jesus ascends to His Father, and is “seated at the right hand of the Majesty on high”. He is frequently referred to as “Lord” - either because He is identified with the God of Israel, or because He is God’s Chosen King, or because He is both.

    https://www.biblehub.com/psalms/110-1.htm - many parallel passages are quoted

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/sear...=s_primary_0_1

    This passage from the very beginning of the Letter to the Hebrews is striking:

    1On many past occasions and in many different ways, God spoke to our fathers through the prophets. 2But in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the universe.

    3 He is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of His nature, upholding all things by His powerful word. After He had provided purification for sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.4So He became as far superior to the angels as the name He has inherited is excellent beyond theirs. 5For to which of the angels did God ever say:

    “You are My Son; today I have become Your Father”a ?

    Or again:

    “I will be His Father, and He will be My Son”b ?

    6And again, when God brings His firstborn into the world, He says:

    “Let all God’s angels worship Him.”c

    7Now about the angels He says:

    “He makes His angels winds, His servants flames of fire.”d

    8But about the Son He says:

    “Your throne, O God, endures forever and ever, and justice is the scepter of Your kingdom.9You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, Your God, has anointed You above Your companions with the oil of joy.”e

    10And:

    “In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth,and the heavens are the work of Your hands.11They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment.12You will roll them up like a robe; like a garmentf they will be changed; but You remain the same, and Your years will never end.”g

    13Yet to which of the angels did God ever say:

    “Sit at My right hand until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet”h ?

    14Are not the angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation ?

    https://www.biblehub.com/bsb/hebrews/1.htm

    The words of Psalm 110 are quoted to show that Jesus, God’s Chosen King, above the angels, and is, in fact, God. They all show that He is our High Priest, Who has “provided purification for sins” (see also Hebrews chapters 7-10).


    Last edited by Rushing Jaws; 07-30-2019 at 09:32 PM.

  2. #132
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rushing Jaws View Post
    To be specific, it is an echo of Psalm 110.1:

    “The LORD said to my Lord:
    Sit thou at My right hand,
    Until I make thine enemies thy footstool”.

    The passage is a speech of God to the king He has chosen. And for the New Testament authors, Jesus, the son of David, is that King. And that passage is fulfilled when Jesus ascends to His Father, and is “seated at the right hand of the Majesty on high”. He is frequently referred to as “Lord” - either because He is identified with the God of Israel, or because He is God’s Chosen King, or because He is both.

    https://www.biblehub.com/psalms/110-1.htm - many parallel passages are quoted

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/sear...=s_primary_0_1

    This passage from the very beginning of the Letter to the Hebrews is striking:

    1On many past occasions and in many different ways, God spoke to our fathers through the prophets. 2But in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the universe.

    3 He is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of His nature, upholding all things by His powerful word. After He had provided purification for sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.4So He became as far superior to the angels as the name He has inherited is excellent beyond theirs. 5For to which of the angels did God ever say:

    “You are My Son; today I have become Your Father”a ?

    Or again:

    “I will be His Father, and He will be My Son”b ?

    6And again, when God brings His firstborn into the world, He says:

    “Let all God’s angels worship Him.”c

    7Now about the angels He says:

    “He makes His angels winds, His servants flames of fire.”d

    8But about the Son He says:

    “Your throne, O God, endures forever and ever, and justice is the scepter of Your kingdom.9You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, Your God, has anointed You above Your companions with the oil of joy.”e

    10And:

    “In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth,and the heavens are the work of Your hands.11They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment.12You will roll them up like a robe; like a garmentf they will be changed; but You remain the same, and Your years will never end.”g

    13Yet to which of the angels did God ever say:

    “Sit at My right hand until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet”h ?

    14Are not the angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation ?

    https://www.biblehub.com/bsb/hebrews/1.htm

    The words of Psalm 110 are quoted to show that Jesus, God’s Chosen King, above the angels, and is, in fact, God. They all show that He is our High Priest, Who has “provided purification for sins” (see also Hebrews chapters 7-10).




    Many thanks.

    The problem does not end here. In Revelation 3:21, Jesus said " I was victorious and sat down with my Father on his throne";therefore, "God" Jesus sitting with God the Father requires more than one God while 1 Corinthians 8:4 says "there is no other God but one"

  3. #133
    tWebber
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    Not only does this guy have an over-thick skull, he also displays total disregard to proper principles of basic Biblical and scripture exegesis.

    The 'multiplicity of Gods' exists only in his puny, closed and made-up mind! 'Hakeem' would probably jump up & down in rage when it can be shown from the Koran that islamic monotheism or 'tawheed' is nothing but a pretentious sham, totally inconsistent with what orthodox islam and sunnis were trying so hard to peddle from the era of the korans burning centuries ago.


    Quote Originally Posted by Same Hakeem View Post
    Many thanks.

    The problem does not end here. In Revelation 3:21, Jesus said " I was victorious and sat down with my Father on his throne";therefore, "God" Jesus sitting with God the Father requires more than one God while 1 Corinthians 8:4 says "there is no other God but one"

  4. #134
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Zebiri View Post
    Not only does this guy have an over-thick skull, he also displays total disregard to proper principles of basic Biblical and scripture exegesis.

    The 'multiplicity of Gods' exists only in his puny, closed and made-up mind! 'Hakeem' would probably jump up & down in rage when it can be shown from the Koran that islamic monotheism or 'tawheed' is nothing but a pretentious sham, totally inconsistent with what orthodox islam and sunnis were trying so hard to peddle from the era of the korans burning centuries ago.
    My advice to you is to quote the Bible when I quote the Bible to show that trinity is not Biblical.

  5. #135
    tWebber Chrawnus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Same Hakeem View Post
    My advice to you is to quote the Bible when I quote the Bible to show that trinity is not Biblical.
    The only thing you demonstrate when you quote the Bible is that your English reading comprehension skills are lacking.

  6. Amen Christian3 amen'd this post.
  7. #136
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Same Hakeem View Post
    Many thanks.

    The problem does not end here. In Revelation 3:21, Jesus said " I was victorious and sat down with my Father on his throne";therefore, "God" Jesus sitting with God the Father requires more than one God while 1 Corinthians 8:4 says "there is no other God but one"
    When reading Scriptures keep in mind that Christians only believe in one God -- one Being in three persons -- Father, God's Word (son by relationship) and the Holy Spirit. Nowhere in the Qur'an does your Allah refute the Trinity -- Father, Son and Holy Spirit as one Being in three persons.

    The author of the Qur'an thought the trinity was Allah, Jesus and the virgin Mary.

    The author of the Qur'an had never heard of the incarnation because the author of the Qur'an said that Jesus could not be God because He had to eat food. Christians have always believed Jesus was fully human so of course He had to eat food.

    As for Revelation 3:21:

    I found the following in Michael Brown's "Answering Jewish Objections to Jesus" Volume Two.

    "Consider these verses from the last book of the New Testament, the Book of Revelation. In Revelation 3:21, Jesus declares that he sat down with the Father on his throne, but what does that mean? According to Revelation 4:2, John, who wrote the Book of Revelation, is caught up in the Spirit and sees "a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it."

    "It was "the Lord God Almighty, who was, and is, and is to come" (Revelation 4:8). Next, John sees "a Lamb [representing Jesus], looking as if it had been slain, standing in the center of the throne" (Revelation 5:6). And as the heavenly drama unfolds, John records: "Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, singing: "To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!" (Revelation 5:13).

    "Did you notice those words? "To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb." Now pay careful attention. In Revelation 7:9, John sees a multitude" standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb," and they cry out, "Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne and to the Lamb" (Revelation 7:10).

    "The general picture is clear, but the specifics are not as easy to decipher: God sits on his throne, and with him is the Lamb, yet this Lamb is "at the center of the throne" (Revelation 5:6; Revelation 7:17). What exactly does this mean? There is some mystery involved, without doubt.

    "Then we come to the end of the book, and in a real sense, the end of the story. Revelation 22:1 speaks of "the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb." "Mark those words carefully, the throne of God and of the Lamb. And now look at these astounding verses: "The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city [i.e., the New Jerusalem], and his servants will serve him. They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads" (Revelation 22:3-4)

    "What an incredible description! There is one throne for God and the Lamb (not two thrones), and his servants (not their servants) will serve him (not them) and see his face (not their faces). One throne, one God, and one face. This is profound, glorious monotheistic truth at its best. Our God is complex and unique! And so the angel exhorts John in Revelation 22:9, "Worship God!' not "Worship gods." Perish the thought. The one God of Abraham and Moses is the one God of Peter and Paul."

  8. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Same Hakeem View Post
    My advice to you is to quote the Bible when I quote the Bible to show that trinity is not Biblical.
    The concept of the Trinity is Biblical:

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm...ty/trinity.cfm

    https://www.monergism.com/topics/trinity

    https://www.monergism.com/topics/tri...idence-trinity

  9. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrawnus View Post
    The only thing you demonstrate when you quote the Bible is that your English reading comprehension skills are lacking.
    He's trying to save the Qur'an, but it can't be done.

  10. #139
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    Absolutely right, your observation describes hakeem's shallow and twisted mind and thoughts to a tee, LOL!

    He is totally incapable and intentionally unwilling to use his brain to grasp the facts already put to him.

    It's just casting pearls before swine here, like the Lord Jesus Christ already warned!

    Dan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrawnus View Post
    The only thing you demonstrate when you quote the Bible is that your English reading comprehension skills are lacking.

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