Originally posted by carpedm9587
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Shutdown Over Border Security?
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That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostThe "elections have consequences" quote has long been attributed to Obama as being from a response he made to Republican Whip Eric Cantor concerning the ACA. Your comment about "scant evidence" made me go digging. Pretty much every reference I find sources back to the same place. I am not not finding any other corroborating site, or independent report. That source appears to be a blog of some sort. So I guess I have to acknowledge that there is no strong evidence that Obama ever said this - unless someone else can point me to other sources...?Last edited by Starlight; 01-14-2019, 06:14 PM."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostAdam Silver even admitted they were horribly wrong and that they needed to seriously adjust their methodology.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostYou can't be that naive...The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostBecause "Trump is mean and a Ruskie" makes them look like idiots.
Surely you can't be that naive...The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostNo he can't. His companies don't own the land.
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So this article is interesting. Here's what I think is wrong with Mulvaney's and Vought's position: a shutdown is actually MORE expensive for the government than regular operation. This is because the workers are eventually given their pay, including the "unnecessary" furloughed workers. So same amount out - without the work getting done. And when they get back all of that backlogged work needs to be done so... can you say overtime? Temps? Contractors?
The furloughed "unnecessary" workers are basically getting weeks and weeks of vacation time - they just have to hang in there long enough to collect at the end. For the furloughed workers - that may not be as big a problem. They can go looking for other jobs (of course, low unemployment will be their enemy). It's the "necessary" employees that are really screwed: they have to keep working without the pay, which means any paying work they get has to be in addition to their day job. I would imagine some of these are family people - so there goes the family time. So much for "family values."
Really - Trump should wake up and begin negotiating. However, I truly hope he doesn't. Much as it means these people are going to continue to hurt - every day the shutdown continues erodes Trump's numbers and support. Not his base, mind you - but the rest. If we have to suffer some pain before people wake up to the travesty in our White House - then so be it. So go, Trump, go! Double Down! Make that shutdown last until Tuesday, November 3, 2020!
And if Dems are smart, they'll start grassroots programs to help the furloughed employees meet their financial obligations. That would make them serious heroes. Maybe a GoFundMe page?Last edited by carpedm9587; 01-14-2019, 07:12 PM.The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas
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In the future they should probably plot budgets for government employees and contractors out further than the rest of the budget, so that if any shutdowns occur, people can at least still get paid and don't have a reason to dodge work. The VA is still getting funded because it got some kind of extended budget plan from the last time its funding got set, so I figure they could do something like that for other parts of government to at least provide pay for people.
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostShe isn't interested in ANY wall and her pansy socialist base is cheering her on. And the liberal media is narrating the story just how she wants it - with half truths and outright lies. Not that you'd know what the truth was about US border security anyway...
No it isn't. They have shown time and time again that they will throw a token pittance to a few small areas to hire an extra border guard or two, and maybe one or two drones to fly around and record border crossings to post to YouTube, but that's about it. That's why CNN called successful border security a "non-story".
That "bipartisan" legislation was nowhere near enough to do what needs to be done. But again, if you are ignorant of what the border patrol actually say they need, you have no clue how much it costs.
you forgot the [/cite=CNN] after that turd.
Exactly. This quote shows the utter ignorance of Congress on BOTH sides on what is needed to better secure our borders. Walls are neither wasteful nor ineffective. I've shown you several times that it is quite effective in reducing illegal crossings, yet you continue to barf this liberal media lie from thousands of miles away.
1.3 B is only enough to build about 50 miles of new border fence. Talk about ineffective“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostAre you talking about Nate Silver?
I would like to see a source for where Nate Silver said this (if this is who you are talking about).
Nate and the 538 crew were some of the first to raise the "alarm" that the polls were shifting in the final weeks and days of the election and that a Trump win was more likely than a lot of people and websites thought.
And Note that 538 (like RCP) is an aggregator. And a statistical analysis and prediction is not the same as a poll.That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
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Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostSo the polls don't ask "why" because they are afraid the respondents will look like idiots?
Surely you can't be that naive...That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
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Originally posted by JimL View PostYeah, that's another good one. I remember when you conservatives were rabidly against eminent domain.
All of a sudden it's all good? If Obama had ever proposed such a thing Fox News would have had you all up in arms about the government taking peoples property. Oh, and we won't even mention the price tag for that boondoggle of an idea.That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
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Originally posted by JimL View PostNo, it's only a minority, approximately equal to Trumps approval rating.That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
-
Originally posted by carpedm9587 View PostSo this article is interesting. Here's what I think is wrong with Mulvaney's and Vought's position: a shutdown is actually MORE expensive for the government than regular operation. This is because the workers are eventually given their pay, including the "unnecessary" furloughed workers. So same amount out - without the work getting done. And when they get back all of that backlogged work needs to be done so... can you say overtime? Temps? Contractors?
The furloughed "unnecessary" workers are basically getting weeks and weeks of vacation time - they just have to hang in there long enough to collect at the end. For the furloughed workers - that may not be as big a problem. They can go looking for other jobs (of course, low unemployment will be their enemy). It's the "necessary" employees that are really screwed: they have to keep working without the pay, which means any paying work they get has to be in addition to their day job. I would imagine some of these are family people - so there goes the family time. So much for "family values."
Really - Trump should wake up and begin negotiating. However, I truly hope he doesn't. Much as it means these people are going to continue to hurt - every day the shutdown continues erodes Trump's numbers and support. Not his base, mind you - but the rest. If we have to suffer some pain before people wake up to the travesty in our White House - then so be it. So go, Trump, go! Double Down! Make that shutdown last until Tuesday, November 3, 2020!
And if Dems are smart, they'll start grassroots programs to help the furloughed employees meet their financial obligations. That would make them serious heroes. Maybe a GoFundMe page?That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
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