Trump's Christian supporters are unchristian

[JimL]

If that's really what you believe beyond any doubt then no worries, right? You have it made in case you're wrong.

Of course, I don't worry that there might be an idiotic god just because so many idiots believe for no good reason that there is. If there is a god, why should I believe he/she is such an evil entity that he would punish me in some dreadful way for simply not believing he exists? Again, it's just idiotic to believe that, or to fear that.

Of course you should be aware that you beg the question that people are justified to not believe in God's existence.

There is no reason to fear goodness MM, what you fear, and what all religious people fear, is evil, and the possible end to their existence.

[One Bad Pig]

You should try reading some Eastern Orthodox theologians, you might learn something.

Been there, done that (Jaroslav Pelikan, Alexander Schmemann, Andrew Louth, Hilarion Alfayev; John McGuckin is on my to read list) - which is why I can tell that you're whiffing badly (well, that, and the fact that you appear to be confusing the doctrine of atonement with that of the Incarnation). You are aware that the term "theologian" has an entirely different meaning in the East, yes (I've read some of St. Gregory the Theologian, St. Symeon the New Theologian, and all of St. John the Theologian)?

What is your favorite way of describing the doctrine?

I prefer, like the East in general, to stick to what can be deduced from Scripture and apophatically allow a mystery to remain mysterious. I know how NOT to describe it.

[One Bad Pig]

There is no reason to fear goodness MM, what you fear, and what all religious people fear, is evil, and the possible end to their existence.

Stop me if I've mentioned this before, but you're really, really bad at reading minds, Jim. Stick to coloring books, and try to stay within the lines.

[Starlight]

I know how NOT to describe it.

If you're not prepared to even articulate a basic description of the teaching yourself, objecting to my description doesn't carry much water.

You've reminded me that an excessive focus on 'mystery' needs to be added to my list of EO silliness.

[Starlight]

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I take it like RumTumTugger you didn't understand my post any better than you understand your bibles. OBP and I both have strong knowledge of EO teachings, have read many EO theologians, and have talked about it on this site several times over the past 10 years. My post was somewhat tongue in cheek - he's accusing me of getting it wrong and I'm accusing him of getting it wrong. OBP is also aware I've researched and written a book on the topic of the evolution of Christian theology of atonement and salvation through history, and judging by your reaction I'm guessing you're not aware of this.

[JimL]

Stop me if I've mentioned this before, but you're really, really bad at reading minds, Jim. Stick to coloring books, and try to stay within the lines.

Your religious beliefs betray you. You fear the existence of a god that will do you harm if you do not believe he exists. I know, I know, you tell yourself it isn't fear, but it is, you've been in denial for so long you just don't know the difference. It's all about the reward and or the punishment, it's all about whats in it for you.

[Charles]

Of course my favorite part is when non-Christians want to mock and laugh at Christianity and then get their noses out of joint when Christians hit back.

I feel a long way from the sermon on the mount:

Matthew 5

7 Blessed are the merciful,
for they will be shown mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart,
for they will see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they will be called children of God.
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

[Charles]

And I am sure you recognize that begging the question is not a valid argument. I have still not seen a single argument that proves that Trump's policies are necessarily wrong, and I have not seen a single quote from scripture from you or anybody else that would preclude a Christian from voting for or otherwise supporting a less than morally perfect politician.

But as you say, dodge noted.

Another manipulation. The point is not that you cannot vote for or support a less than morally perfect politician, and I believe you know that. The point is that you should not continue to support them or support them in everything they do since all people are less than morally perfect which is why we all need to be corrected at times. I guess you must have missed my quotes since I am sure you would have reflected a little on how you should treat the stranger and the hungry if you had actually read that Jesus identified with those. I am also sure that someone who truly reflected on and believed that all human beings are bearers of the image of God would be a bit reluctant as to taking screaming children from their parents. I was a stranger but it seems he was not that stranger, or? It is rather interesting to see a Christian ask for proof that inhumane policies are necessarily wrong... Reflect a bit on that.

But of course you supported the body slam stuff and failed to raise your voice to stand for what is right with regards to family separations, Khashoggi and I could go on. Those are not cases of supporting a less than morally perfect politician. They are cases of supporting what is wrong.

[Charles]

Like the old joke goes...

"Why would I want to join a church? They're full of liars and hypocrites!"

"In that case, you'll fit right in."

Here is another old joke:

“Almighty God, I am sorry I am now an atheist, but have You read Nietzsche?”

[rogue06]

I take it like RumTumTugger you didn't understand my post any better than you understand your bibles. OBP and I both have strong knowledge of EO teachings, have read many EO theologians, and have talked about it on this site several times over the past 10 years. My post was somewhat tongue in cheek - he's accusing me of getting it wrong and I'm accusing him of getting it wrong. OBP is also aware I've researched and written a book on the topic of the evolution of Christian theology of atonement and salvation through history, and judging by your reaction I'm guessing you're not aware of this.

Over the years there have been a wide variety of people on this board who have written books on various subjects and claimed that made them an expert on the topic. We even had one guy who wrote about how Yahweh was a fire-breathing dragon.

[Mountain Man]

I feel a long way from the sermon on the mount:

Matthew 5

There is, of course, nothing in the Sermon on the Mount that would preclude a Christian from mounting a spirited and vigorous defense of the gospel as evidenced by Jesus' own conduct in public debates. But that doesn't stop ignorant and manipulative atheists like you from quoting the passage if they think they can cow Christians into acting like wimps.

I am also sure that someone who truly reflected on and believed that all human beings are bearers of the image of God would be a bit reluctant as to taking screaming children from their parents.

Not an accurate representation of what's happening on the border, but nice try. It is only those who try to enter the country illegally who are separated from their children (family units who come through a proper port of entry and request asylum are allowed to stay together); their children, in turn, are well cared for while their case is sorted out:

Source: Inside Shelter for Illegal Alien Children Separated from Parents

Once the children arrive — usually brought by U.S. Border Patrol agents — they are greeted in the “intake” office, where they receive any urgent medical care, are assigned a case worker, and are given food, a shower, and new clothing. They are also given toiletries and lessons in hygiene — literally how to flush a toilet, brush their teeth, and operate the shower, which some of the children may have never seen in their lives.

The children receive six hours of education daily, which include lessons in English and physical education. The boys interact with girls who are housed offsite and brought to the shelter during the day to access its services.

They have limited access to telephones to call relatives, both in the U.S. and abroad. They receive therapy, both as individuals and in group sessions. They enjoy field trips to local museums, parks, and the zoo, where they can explore the city beyond the shelter. And they also have social activities, including a recent “prom” for which they dressed up.

“Cages,” these are not. What is immediately striking about the facility is the enthusiasm and care of the staff who work there. One administrator greeted the journalists on the tour: “Welcome to our home.” The children at the facility seemed genuinely happy, despite their unfortunate circumstances and the trauma of their long journey.

The real scandal is how the media have portrayed the shelters.

https://www.breitbart.com/local/2018...-from-parents/

© Copyright Original Source

It's a far cry from the Obama administration who literally caged the children like they were animals.

It is rather interesting to see a Christian ask for proof that inhumane policies are necessarily wrong... Reflect a bit on that.

I ask because your description of current events (i.e. "taking screaming children from their parents") is inaccurate, deceptive, and emotionally manipulative. So naturally I'm going to ask for proof when you (falsely) accuse President Trump of promoting inhumane policies.

[Mountain Man]

Your religious beliefs betray you. You fear the existence of a god that will do you harm if you do not believe he exists. I know, I know, you tell yourself it isn't fear, but it is, you've been in denial for so long you just don't know the difference. It's all about the reward and or the punishment, it's all about whats in it for you.

Psychological projection is a defence mechanism in which the human ego defends itself against unconscious impulses or qualities (both positive and negative) by denying their existence in themselves while attributing them to others.

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Psychological_projection

[Mountain Man]

Over the years there have been a wide variety of people on this board who have written books on various subjects and claimed that made them an expert on the topic. We even had one guy who wrote about how Yahweh was a fire-breathing dragon.

And remember "Bible Wheel"?

[JimL]

Psychological projection is a defence mechanism in which the human ego defends itself against unconscious impulses or qualities (both positive and negative) by denying their existence in themselves while attributing them to others.

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Psychological_projection

It's all about what's in it for you, MM.

[JimL]

Over the years there have been a wide variety of people on this board who have written books on various subjects and claimed that made them an expert on the topic. We even had one guy who wrote about how Yahweh was a fire-breathing dragon.

He was probably using that (a fire breathing dragon) as a metaphor. It is, after all, apropo.