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Thread: Jerry Falwell, Jr. vs. Jesus

  1. #21
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill the Cat View Post
    Poor government meaning lack of proper resources to pay for the things a government should. As opposed to a rich government that can pay for them.
    So, greater GDP, or higher taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill the Cat View Post
    To which he PURPOSEFULLY separated the spiritual discussion from the earthly discussion. He's not saying Christians should not be generous, nor is he saying the giving of individual poor isn't a spiritual matter, and worthy of praise. He's saying that a government needs money to be able to effectively help the poor, and if it lacks it, they are not very able to assist.
    Right, I understand that's what his intention was, but it was poorly phrased.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill the Cat View Post
    That's not even remotely what he is talking about.
    It's the conflation between America, the country, helping people elsewhere and individual poor people not being able to donate more that bothers me. Nations vs private actions, it doesn't work as a metaphor. When it comes to choosing politicians, it's not a choice between an immoral rich person with great business sense and a virtuous pauper with terrible policies. At least in the case of the President, it's two wealthy people of questionable morality and vaguely defined goals arguing that the other person's crimes are worse. I'm sure he isn't trying to say wealth is better, but the comparison doesn't follow from the argument.

  2. #22
    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Since I am somehow inexplicably able to penetrate WaPo's force-field, I will quote and comment on a few portions besides what Bill the Cat provided in Reply 10.

    Source: WaPo

    You said recently that conservatives and Christians should stop electing nice guys. Arenít Christians supposed to be nice guys?

    Of course, of course. But thatís where people get confused. I almost laugh out loud when I hear Democrats saying things like, ďJesus said suffer the little children to come unto meĒ and try to use that as the reason we should open up our borders.

    Itís such a distortion of the teachings of Jesus to say that what he taught us to do personally ó to love our neighbors as ourselves, help the poor ó can somehow be imputed on a nation. Jesus never told Caesar how to run Rome. He went out of his way to say thatís the earthly kingdom, Iím about the heavenly kingdom and Iím here to teach you how to treat others, how to help others, but when it comes to serving your country, you render unto Caesar that which is Caesarís. Itís a distortion of the teaching of Christ to say Jesus taught love and forgiveness and therefore the United States as a nation should be loving and forgiving, and just hand over everything we have to every other part of the world. Thatís not what Jesus taught. You almost have to believe that this is a theocracy to think that way, to think that public policy should be dictated by the teachings of Jesus.

    So, the government you want is one free of religious association?

    Yes. The government should be led by somebody who is going to do whatís in the best interest of the government and its people. And I believe thatís what Jesus thought, too.

    © Copyright Original Source



    This part above is foundational to the article as a whole.


    Source: WaPo

    You pushed for national leaders to use the term ďradical Islamic terrorismĒ when describing Muslims who are terrorists. Should leaders call it ďwhite supremacist terrorismĒ when we have violent acts by white supremacists in this country?

    Sure, if a terrorist is someone who is trying to overthrow a political regime. I guess it depends on what your definition of terrorism is. Anybody who kills anybody else or commits violence against anybody else because of their race is horrible. Itís just as bad as the 9/11 attack.

    © Copyright Original Source



    This is good, except he should have gone out of his way to include Antifa as terrorists. Wuss.


    Source: WaPo

    You and other white evangelical leaders have strongly supported President Trump. What about him exemplifies Christianity and earns him your support?

    What earns him my support is his business acumen. Our country was so deep in debt and so mismanaged by career politicians that we needed someone who was not a career politician, but someone whoíd been successful in business to run the country like a business. Thatís the reason I supported him.

    © Copyright Original Source



    His reasons are not the same as mine, but they are fine.

    Notice he did NOT claim that anything about Trump "exemplifies Christianity." At this point, I will again bring up an underused point that I have not noticed anyone else addressing: If "exemplifying Christianity" is important, Christians would not vote for a pseudo-Christian cultist such as Romney or any other Mormon.


    Source: WaPo

    Is there anything President Trump could do that would endanger that support from you or other evangelical leaders?

    No.

    Thatís the shortest answer weíve had so far.

    Only because I know that he only wants whatís best for this country, and I know anything he does, it may not be ideologically ďconservative,Ē but itís going to be whatís best for this country, and I canít imagine him doing anything thatís not good for the country.

    © Copyright Original Source



    The unqualified "No" is astonishingly stupid. I don't *expect* him to do any such thing, but if, e.g., he did something like diddling a young intern with a cigar during his Presidency, I would totally abandon him and call for his resignation, and I hope all Evangelicals would do likewise.


    Source: WaPo

    Is it hypocritical for evangelical leaders to support a leader who has advocated violence and who has committed adultery and lies often? I understand that a person can be forgiven their sins, but should that person be leading the country?

    When Jesus said weíre all sinners, he really meant all of us, everybody. I donít think you can choose a president based on their personal behavior because even if you choose the one that you think is the most decent ó letís say you decide Mitt Romney. Nobody could be a more decent human being, better family man. But there might be things that heís done that we just donít know about. So you donít choose a president based on how good they are; you choose a president based on what their policies are. Thatís why I donít think itís hypocritical.

    Thereís two kingdoms. Thereís the earthly kingdom and the heavenly kingdom. In the heavenly kingdom the responsibility is to treat others as youíd like to be treated. In the earthly kingdom, the responsibility is to choose leaders who will do whatís best for your country. Think about it. Why have Americans been able to do more to help people in need around the world than any other country in history? Itís because of free enterprise, freedom, ingenuity, entrepreneurism and wealth. A poor person never gave anyone a job. A poor person never gave anybody charity, not of any real volume. Itís just common sense to me.

    © Copyright Original Source



    This is the portion previously cited. I'm disappointed that he missed an excellent opportunity to denigrate Romney's religion. (I am mainly in favor of doing so in cases where it is one that pretends to be Christian.)

    It honestly baffles me that people insist on imposing Mark 12 / Luke 21 on this. He is not denigrating poor people, he is advocating for an economy that reduces their number.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

    Beige Nationalist.

    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

  3. Amen Sparko, Cow Poke, One Bad Pig, Bill the Cat amen'd this post.
  4. #23
    Professor Catholicity's Avatar
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    I can read the Washington Post Rogue.
    A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
    George Bernard Shaw

  5. #24
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catholicity View Post
    I can read the Washington Post Rogue.
    Thank a teacher!



    --- this space intentionally left blank ---

  6. #25
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catholicity View Post
    I can read the Washington Post Rogue.
    What is the Washington Post Rogue?
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. Ė St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

  7. #26
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    What is the Washington Post Rogue?
    It is what is left after rogue got done with it. It's post Rogue. PR.

  8. #27
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    It is what is left after rogue got done with it. It's post Rogue. PR.
    Ah, scattered ashes.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" -- starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)

  9. #28
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    Ah, scattered ashes.
    In that case, reading it is quite a feat!
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. Ė St. John Chrysostom

    Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio

    I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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