So what is this toxic masculinity thing anyhow?

[JimL]

And are they good or bad sane people JimL?

You do what we call sinning all the time Sparko. So, are you a good or a bad sane person?

[Sparko]

You do what we call sinning all the time Sparko. So, are you a good or a bad sane person?

Jim you said that they were sane. I can see them being sane and evil. But I can't see them being sane and good. Can you? Do you think it is good to fantasize about having sex with children?

Either insane or evil.
Please offer me another choice if you wish.

[JimL]

Jim you said that they were sane. I can see them being sane and evil. But I can't see them being sane and good. Can you? Do you think it is good to fantasize about having sex with children?

Either insane or evil.
Please offer me another choice if you wish.

How about human. You should know that people who commit what we call sins are neither insane or evil.

[Sparko]

How about human. You should know that people who commit what we call sins are neither insane or evil.

"human" doesn't say anything about them or their motivations at all JimL. Of course they are human.

And are you now arguing that pedophilia is neither insane NOR evil? You can't seem to keep from cramming more of your foot into your mouth.

And I am asking YOU, who don't even believe in "sin" and I never mentioned "sin".

So if a pedophile is not insane, then is he a good HUMAN or a bad HUMAN for seeking out sex with children?

At this point maybe you should just stop before you hurt yourself. You are like some punk wanting to fight someone and the other guy just stands there while you keep missing and punching yourself in the face.

[JimL]

"human" doesn't say anything about them or their motivations at all JimL. Of course they are human.

And are you now arguing that pedophilia is neither insane NOR evil? You can't seem to keep from cramming more of your foot into your mouth.

And I am asking YOU, who don't even believe in "sin" and I never mentioned "sin".

So if a pedophile is not insane, then is he a good HUMAN or a bad HUMAN for seeking out sex with children?

At this point maybe you should just stop before you hurt yourself. You are like some punk wanting to fight someone and the other guy just stands there while you keep missing and punching yourself in the face.

Sparko, what I'm telling you is that it is not a black and white issue like you are trying to make it. People aren't evil or insane because they do or think bad things. Simple as that. If they were then you are either evil or insane. Are you?

[Sparko]

Sparko, what I'm telling you is that it is not a black and white issue like you are trying to make it. People aren't evil or insane because they do or think bad things. Simple as that. If they were then you are either evil or insane. Are you?

JimL, we are not talking about cheating on your taxes or lying about something to your wife. We are talking about something that is at the core of a person. Something that makes them who they are. If a nice granny who takes care of kittens and bakes cakes for her neighbors is also a serial killer at night, then even though she does some good, she is EVIL (or insane) - because murder is evil. It defines their person.

So can you at least agree that the act of having sex with children is evil/immoral.


if someone is a pedophile there are two options that I can think of:

1. There is something wrong with them mentally
2. They are evil.

If there is another option, just list it:

3.
4.

[JimL]

JimL, we are not talking about cheating on your taxes or lying about something to your wife. We are talking about something that is at the core of a person. Something that makes them who they are. If a nice granny who takes care of kittens and bakes cakes for her neighbors is also a serial killer at night, then even though she does some good, she is EVIL (or insane) - because murder is evil. It defines their person.

So can you at least agree that the act of having sex with children is evil/immoral.


if someone is a pedophile there are two options that I can think of:

1. There is something wrong with them mentally
2. They are evil.

If there is another option, just list it:

3.
4.

Of course it is immoral, we define it as immoral for a reason and the reason is because for one thing children aren't old enough to know better, and two, because it can cause emotional damage to the child.

[Cow Poke]

Of course it is immoral, we define it as immoral for a reason and the reason is because for one thing children aren't old enough to know better, and two, because it can cause emotional damage to the child.

Yet, you're the guy who was arguing in defense of NAMBLA concerning the age of consent.

So what, maybe IGLA at the time agreed with NAMBLA that the age of consent law was oppressive to youth, but they were never advocates of pedophilia which they made clear long before they ousted NAMBLA.

You couldn't even figure out what a "boy" was (The "B" in NAMBLA).

[Sparko]

Of course it is immoral, we define it as immoral for a reason and the reason is because for one thing children aren't old enough to know better, and two, because it can cause emotional damage to the child.

OK so Pedophilia is Immoral. Is "Immoral" "good" or "evil?"

[One Bad Pig]

OK so Pedophilia is Immoral. Is "Immoral" "good" or "evil?"

I think what JimL is trying to say is that, as long as the thoughts are not acted on, no harm no foul.

[Sparko]

I think what JimL is trying to say is that, as long as the thoughts are not acted on, no harm no foul.

Well it started out as what is insanity? Tassman said that someone isn't insane unless their thoughts cause them distress. So I said that means under those conditions if you had two men, both obsessed with thoughts of having sex with children and one recognizes it is wrong and seeks help, then that would mean he was insane since it caused him distress. The other man, who has the same fantasies but actually enjoys them and plans on acting on them, would be perfectly normal and sane using Tassman's definition since he was not distressed.

Tassman could not admit to this conundrum. I said that if someone was obsessed with sex with children and planned on carrying it out, he was not normal, he was either insane or evil.

JimL said that it was not evil and he wasn't insane. I kept asking him for another alternative. If he wants to have sex with children isn't that immoral? JimL agreed. So now that he has admitted that I want to know if being immoral is good or evil.

The whole situation is predicated on the guy who WANTS and PLANS to act out his pedophile desires. Not the guy who has the desires and doesn't want to act on them.

[Tassman]

Well it started out as what is insanity? Tassman said that someone isn't insane unless their thoughts cause them distress. So I said that means under those conditions if you had two men, both obsessed with thoughts of having sex with children and one recognizes it is wrong and seeks help, then that would mean he was insane since it caused him distress. The other man, who has the same fantasies but actually enjoys them and plans on acting on them, would be perfectly normal and sane using Tassman's definition since he was not distressed.

Tassman could not admit to this conundrum. I said that if someone was obsessed with sex with children and planned on carrying it out, he was not normal, he was either insane or evil.

or impairment of personal functioning

[Sparko]

or impairment of personal functioning

And that is what my example showed was just plain wrong. If you have two people, both having desires and fantasies about having sex with children and one is distressed by it and goes to the doctor, he is considered mentally ill. Yet the second one who embraces his desires and fantasies and enjoys them yet still has not acted on them for whatever reason is not mentally ill.

That's just stupid Tass. The second guy is clearly MORE mentally ill than the first because the first one at least has the sense to know what he is thinking about is wrong and to seek help.

[JimL]

OK so Pedophilia is Immoral. Is "Immoral" "good" or "evil?"

Immorality is that which we define as evil, but it doesn't make the person himself insane or mentally ill.

[Cow Poke]

You are being utterly dishonest, shame on you

This is very similar to JimL accusing somebody else of being an idiot.