So what is this toxic masculinity thing anyhow?

[JimL]

We've been over this already, this is a legal objection and not a moral one. Simply change the law, and this objection disappears.

No, it isn't birdbrain, it is a legal objection based on a moral one, the child is to immature to give consent.

Right, and if the "community" changes its mind regarding pedophilia, you have no grounds to object.

The grounds of onjecting to pedophilia is reason, regardless of what the community does.

[Mountain Man]

No, it isn't birdbrain, it is a legal objection based on a moral one, the child is to immature to give consent.


The grounds of onjecting to pedophilia is reason, regardless of what the community does.

But you said yourself that society can "evolve" and change its views over time. You also failed to provide any way of determining when society has finally gotten it "right" and can stop evolving.

[JimL]

But you said yourself that society can "evolve" and change its views over time.

Right, and that's what we do, such as in the case of sexual orientation. Through reason and science we recognize our mistakes and correct them.

You also failed to provide any way of determining when society has finally gotten it "right" and can stop evolving.

We are not omniscient and morals are not set in stone which is why the bible only mentions a few and even some of those are ridiculous.

[Mountain Man]

Right, and that's what we do, such as in the case of sexual orientation. Through reason and science we recognize our mistakes and correct them.

We are not omniscient and morals are not set in stone which is why the bible only mentions a few and even some of those are ridiculous.

You still haven't explained how we are to know when science and reason have gotten it "right" or "wrong", and I suspect your entire thought process here is grounded in the "is-ought" fallacy.

Also, claiming that the Bible only has "a few" moral instructions is laughably naive.

[RumTumTugger]

Your typical response summed up nicely there Jimmy.

what can you expect of NPC JimL you brought up something that his leftist programmers didn't program a response to so he had to go with his default. rather then admit that a minor child is not mature enough to provide informed consent to the killing an unborn human being in her womb.

[Tassman]

We've been over this already, this is a legal objection and not a moral one. Simply change the law, and this objection disappears.

Any change of Law involves the consent of society based on current social mores.

Right, and if the "community" changes its mind regarding pedophilia, you have no grounds to object.

ALL moral values arise via man living in community. These include the moral values attributed to a deity, given that the existence of deities also arose via man living in community.

[Mountain Man]

Any change of Law involves the consent of society based on current social mores.


ALL moral values arise via man living in community. These include the moral values attributed to a deity, given that the existence of deities also arose via man living in community.

I assume if you realized that this supports my position and undermines yours that you'd abandon this line of argument.

[One Bad Pig]

I assume if you realized that this supports my position and undermines yours that you'd abandon this line of argument.

Tassman's not very good at that. He prefers to repeat his bad arguments until people get bored with correcting him for the umpteenth time. Then he can bring it up later as a "victory" because his argument hasn't been "refuted."

[Sparko]

his preference vs that of current social values which have the force of Law to ensure compliance.

so it just boils down to "current social mores" then.

So it is perfectly moral to toss gays off of rooftops in Muslim societies then, right?

[Cow Poke]

so it just boils down to "current social mores" then.

So it is perfectly moral to toss gays off of rooftops in Muslim societies then, right?

As long as they yell "allahu akbar" during the toss.

[Bill the Cat]

As long as they yell "allahu akbar" during the toss.

Islam is the only religion that when people loudly yell its slogan, people are afraid...

[Cow Poke]

Islam is the only religion that when people loudly yell its slogan, people are afraid...

And with good reason, since it so often means somebody is about to get dead.

[Tassman]

I assume if you realized that this supports my position and undermines yours that you'd abandon this line of argument.

[Tassman]

so it just boils down to "current social mores" then.

So it is perfectly moral to toss gays off of rooftops in Muslim societies then, right?

Tossing gays off of rooftops does not reflect current social mores, it reflects those of an ancient religion. The current social mores of civilized countries, such as Australia and the US, recognize equal rights for all.

[Bill the Cat]

Tossing gays off of rooftops does not reflect current social mores, it reflects those of an ancient religion. The current social mores of civilized countries, such as Australia and the US, recognize equal rights for all.

Classic imperialist attitude.