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  • #76
    Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
    Yes, simple interdependence can evolve, but it becomes unlikely when the system is complex.
    Define "unlikely" and "complex" in a way that's scientifically meaningful.

    How many threads do we have to go through this in?
    "Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from trolling."

    Comment


    • #77
      Originally posted by TheLurch View Post
      Define "unlikely" and "complex" in a way that's scientifically meaningful.
      Israeli scientists have developed what they hope will be a cure for cancer, it involves a three-factor medication, that evolution is not expected to be able to get past. So unlikely here would be a probability that is vanishingly small, and complex would here be the three factors. So these concepts are judgment calls, I'm not going to be able to give you an equation...

      Blessings,
      Lee
      "What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)

      Comment


      • #78
        Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
        Israeli scientists have developed what they hope will be a cure for cancer, it involves a three-factor medication, that evolution is not expected to be able to get past. So unlikely here would be a probability that is vanishingly small, and complex would here be the three factors. So these concepts are judgment calls, I'm not going to be able to give you an equation...

        Blessings,
        Lee
        Utter confusion not related to the subject. 'Evolution is not expected to be able to get past?' In the course of natural selection in evolution failure is common and species often fail to get past and go extinct.
        Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
        Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
        But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

        go with the flow the river knows . . .

        Frank

        I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by TheLurch View Post
          Define "unlikely" and "complex" in a way that's scientifically meaningful.
          "Unlikely when the system is complex" means a SYSTEM that is complex enough to make it unlikely.
          Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

          MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
          MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

          seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
            Israeli scientists have developed what they hope will be a cure for cancer, it involves a three-factor medication, that evolution is not expected to be able to get past. So unlikely here would be a probability that is vanishingly small, and complex would here be the three factors. So these concepts are judgment calls, I'm not going to be able to give you an equation...
            Then why did you say a system with only two proteins was irreducibly complex?

            And: do you pay attention to your own arguments? Because you've claimed two opposing things ON THE SAME PAGE here.
            "Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from trolling."

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
              Israeli scientists have developed what they hope will be a cure for cancer, it involves a three-factor medication, that evolution is not expected to be able to get past. So unlikely here would be a probability that is vanishingly small, and complex would here be the three factors. So these concepts are judgment calls, I'm not going to be able to give you an equation...

              Blessings,
              Lee
              To add . . . this is not meaningful as the Lurch requested.
              Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
              Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
              But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

              go with the flow the river knows . . .

              Frank

              I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by TheLurch View Post
                Then why did you say a system with only two proteins was irreducibly complex?
                Because it can be a simple IC system, but the sort of IC system that design arguments are based on are more complex than this.

                Blessings,
                Lee
                "What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)

                Comment


                • #83
                  Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
                  Because it can be a simple IC system, but the sort of IC system that design arguments are based on are more complex than this.

                  Blessings,
                  Lee
                  The design arguments have no foundation in the nature of complexity in life.
                  Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                  Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                  But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                  go with the flow the river knows . . .

                  Frank

                  I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Well, I think it's time to stop here, the discussion has wandered far, and I've said all I have to say.

                    Blessings,
                    Lee
                    "What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
                      Well, I think it's time to stop here, the discussion has wandered far, and I've said all I have to say.

                      Blessings,
                      Lee
                      The original problems and answered with references very early in the thread concerning the misuse and misrepresentation of statistics and probability in the original article, which reflects the problems of those at the Discovery Institute.

                      Bottom line is the Discovery Institute has not come up with any falsifiable hypothesis to support Intelligent Design.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Bringing this thread for references on probability and statistics used by fundamentalist creationists at the Discovery Institute and, of course. lee-merrill.
                        Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                        Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                        But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                        go with the flow the river knows . . .

                        Frank

                        I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                          Bringing this thread for references on probability and statistics used by fundamentalist creationists at the Discovery Institute and, of course. lee-merrill.
                          Bringing this thread for references on probability and statistics used by fundamentalist creationists at the Discovery Institute and, of course. lee-merrill.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment

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