Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Ed Markey to unveil 'Green New Deal' bill

[lilpixieofterror]

They haven't gone mad and there's nothing official about your arbitrary personal declaration of a falsehood. Care to cease the crazy?

Also the draft you present is just that: A draft. All legislation gets subjected to lengthy review processes between first draft and final enactment. First drafts are commonly vague and get the details filled in and changed by the select committees in response to expert and public submissions.

As usual, the fact someone thinks these drafts are even a good idea is an indication they are crazy.

[lilpixieofterror]

Part of working on the bill as it develops will to nail down exactly what that does or doesn't mean, assuming that this idea is retained in the final version.

But to give you some examples of what it might mean from my own country where the government has been quite busy on the subject over the past few years...

Government passes Healthy Homes bill, requiring all rentals to be warm and dry

...the new Government have passed a law requiring rentals to be warm, dry, and well ventilated.

The law will require landlords to guarantee that any new tenancy from July 1, 2019 must be either properly insulated or contain a heating source able to make the home warm and dry. All tenancies must meet the new standards by July 1, 2024.

The exact requirements are not in the bill, but will be set by the Government before 2019. Grants of up to $2000 will be available for eligible landlords to upgrade their stock.

A local university has produced the following checklist that they suggested is appropriate for houses to comply with in order to confirm they are warm, dry, safe etc, that they are suggesting the government should adopt:

Kitchen
Wall, ceiling and floor linings intact
Surfaces clear of mould
Functioning stove and oven
Effective ventilation to the outside
+Opening window with secure latch
+ Window security stays (where required)
Adequate food preparation and storage
Hot water at tap (55°C±5°C)
Potable water supply
Waste water drainage with sound connection
Working artificial lighting
Visibly safe power outlets and light switches

Living Areas
Wall, ceiling and floor linings intact
Surfaces clear of mould
Effective ventilation to the outside
+Opening window with secure latch
+ Window security stays (where required)
Working artificial lighting
Heating, fixed, effective and safe
Visibly safe power outlets and light switches
Curtains/blinds/double glazing present

etc. (see the link for other rooms of the house)

Note the lack of who is going to pay for all millions of upgrades.

[Bill the Cat]

Unlike Trump she actually lives it - she took no PAC or big donor money for her campaign. Whereas Trump is probably the single most corrupt president with the single most corrupt cabinet in US history.

The right are such losers that they can only win elections by duping their gullible low-information base into believing they might actually implement left wing policies like anti-corruption laws.

She took PAC money from Justice Democrats and MoveOn

[Starlight]

She took PAC money from Justice Democrats and MoveOn

Oh yup I should have said corporate PACs.

Justice Democrats is a left wing group committed to fighting corruption and campaigning for progressive policies loosely equivalent to what the Tea Party was on the right, and AOC is one of half a dozen members of it to be elected in 2018. And MoveOn is an activist liberal group that's been around for years.

[Starlight]

Note the lack of who is going to pay for all millions of upgrades.

If you're talking about my country then you may have missed the subsidy the govt was providing to landlords for the upgrades. There's been plenty of discussion here about what percentage of the upgrade costs is likely to come out of the landlord's pockets vs be passed on to tenants via rent increases. Nobody thinks such things magically pay for themselves... although maybe you are silly enough to think people think that?!

[Cow Poke]

I often don't agree with her on policy issues, political tactics, public statements, or money in politics, but I will say this for Nancy Pelosi: She is quite astute at her job and balancing competing factions and corralling her caucus to vote with a single voice on issues.

I think part of that is because she knows where the bodies are buried.

[lilpixieofterror]

If you're talking about my country then you may have missed the subsidy the govt was providing to landlords for the upgrades. There's been plenty of discussion here about what percentage of the upgrade costs is likely to come out of the landlord's pockets vs be passed on to tenants via rent increases. Nobody thinks such things magically pay for themselves... although maybe you are silly enough to think people think that?!

Tax money doesn’t magically come from the heavens and how far is this going? Do home owners get a chance to have their homes upgraded too? And how far do these upgrades go?

[lilpixieofterror]

Tax money doesn’t magically come from the heavens and how far is this going? Do home owners get a chance to have their homes upgraded too? And how far do these upgrades go?

I should also note 2000 dollars isn’t a lot to upgrade even one house. A hot water tank could cost you half that amount.

[Mountain Man]

They also want to increase nationwide high speed rail service to the point that air travel will be unnecessary.

Sure, if you don't mind a trip taking 15-hours by train that would take 3-hours by jet.

[lilpixieofterror]

They also want to increase nationwide high speed rail service to the point that air travel will be unnecessary.

Sure, if you don't mind a trip taking 15-hours by train that would take 3-hours by jet.

And skipping smaller destinations, putting tens of thousands of good paid aircraft workers out of work, and setting travel back to the early 20th century. Other than those few issues, it’s a great plan.

[Cow Poke]

Here's where the smartest fart on the planet was mocking my claim to have seen AOC claim this would be done (or projected to be done) in 12 years --- they're actually talking 10!!!

I think I saw today where you got this crazy end of the stick from. In an interview she said she would like the US to aim to be carbon neutral in 12 years.

From the article....

Note: Ocasio-Cortez’s office has taken down their page describing the Green New Deal.

A number of Democratic Party presidential hopefuls — including Cory Booker, Kamala Harris, Elizabeth Warren, Kirsten Gillibrand, Julián Castro, and Beto O’Rourke, for starters — have already endorsed or expressed support for the “Green New Deal” (GND). Today, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Sen. Edward J. Markey dropped details about her plan.

It is not hyperbole to contend that GND is likely the most ridiculous and un-American plan that’s ever been presented by an elected official to voters. Not merely because it would necessitate a communist strongman to institute, but also because the societal cost are unfathomable. The risible historic analogies Markey and Ocasio-Cortez rely on, the building of the interstate highway system or moon landing, are nothing but trifling projects compared to a plan overhauls modernity by voluntarily destroying massive amounts of wealth and technology. That is the GND.

While some of the specifics need to be ironed out, the plan’s authors assure that this “massive transformation of our society” needs some “clear goals and a timeline.” The timeline is ten years. Here are some of the goals:

And the specific claim I saw here talking about (though I'm pretty sure she was saying 12 years -- maybe she thought she needed a 2 year cushion)

Eliminate 99 percent of cars. To be fair, under the GND, everyone will need to retrofit their cars with Flintstones-style foot holes or pedals for cycling. The authors state that the GND would like to replace every “combustion-engine vehicle” — trucks, airplanes, boats, and 99 percent of cars — within ten years. Charging stations for electric vehicles will be built “everywhere,” though how power plants will provide the energy needed to charge them is a mystery.

But, then again, Mr "I know absolutely everything there is to know about the US" admits that he's the biggest exaggerator on the planet*!



*That's a slight exaggeration as he was actually just claiming that "Exaggeration is my favorite rhetorical device"

[Starlight]

Here's where the smartest fart on the planet was mocking my claim to have seen AOC claim this would be done (or projected to be done) in 12 years --- they're actually talking 10!!!

I was mocking your utterly absurd claim of "She wants NO cars or airplanes", not the timeline. Do try to remember the absolute basics from one post to the next.

From the article....

No wonder you believe such wacky things if you read articles like that nonsense.

It is not hyperbole to contend that GND is likely the most ridiculous and un-American plan that’s ever been presented by an elected official to voters.

The writer of that article is an absolute lunatic.

Eliminate 99 percent of cars. To be fair, under the GND, everyone will need to retrofit their cars with Flintstones-style foot holes or pedals for cycling. The authors state that the GND would like to replace every “combustion-engine vehicle” — trucks, airplanes, boats, and 99 percent of cars — within ten years. Charging stations for electric vehicles will be built “everywhere,” though how power plants will provide the energy needed to charge them is a mystery.

The GND wants to transition the US vehicle fleet to electric cars, not abolish cars.

And "Flinstones-style foot holes"... do you know how absurd you make yourself look linking to this sort of drooling insanity of an article?

[Cow Poke]

The writer of that article is an absolute lunatic.

And OAC is a freakin' genius.

[rogue06]

And skipping smaller destinations, putting tens of thousands of good paid aircraft workers out of work, and setting travel back to the early 20th century. Other than those few issues, it’s a great plan.

The left has always had little regard for anything between the coasts except for one or two cities like Chicago (sneeringly referring to it as "fly over country") so I doubt that they'd care much what it would do to them. They might even see driving millions into welfare and unemployment^[1] as a way to recruit new voters.




1. Or as Nancy Pelosi calls it, "funemployment"

[lilpixieofterror]

The left has always had little regard for anything between the coasts except for one or two cities like Chicago (sneeringly referring to it as "fly over country") so I doubt that they'd care much what it would do to them. They might even see driving millions into welfare and unemployment^[1] as a way to recruit new voters.




1. Or as Nancy Pelosi calls it, "funemployment"

Yet they keep failing to understand why the areas between the coast don’t vote for them. I have numberous friends that left the Air Force and went to go work for Boeing, Textron, Learjet, Airbus, Golf-stream, American Airlines, Delta, or United making well over 25 an hour with a rather great benefit package and there’s no reason I can’t join them after my military retirement. Sometimes I wonder if they ever wonder what effects their grand plans have. Aircraft support some rather great middle class jobs and putting them out of business will anger quite a number of people.