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Mayor Pete Attacks Trump's Faith...

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  • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    Understood. These types of discussion are not my cup of tea, so I'll bow out except for my curiosity about Tass' apparent interest in engaging.
    I can only surmise - and perhaps Tass will enlighten us - that Tass' interest in declaring Buttigieg a 'for really Christian' is because he attacks Pence and Trump as NOT being 'for really Christians". And, probably more importantly, because Buttigieg is a homosexual -- that's always a hot bed issue* for Tassman.




    *I started to rephrase that, given the ... um.. I'll let it stand
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      I can only surmise - and perhaps Tass will enlighten us - that Tass' interest in declaring Buttigieg a 'for really Christian' is because he attacks Pence and Trump as NOT being 'for really Christians". And, probably more importantly, because Buttigieg is a homosexual -- that's always a hot bed issue* for Tassman.


      *I started to rephrase that, given the ... um.. I'll let it stand
      Personally, I find this entire discussion to be a marvelous example of "right identity politics." Terms like "cafeteria Christian" and "only being Christian for politic's sake" are, IMO, an attempt to read into a man's inner motivations. As best I can tell, Buttigieg's life has been closely caught up with his faith. I have no idea if he goes to church every Sunday, or otherwise engages with his chosen diocese. I don't actually care. Whether or not he is a "practicing Christian" has no influence on whether or not I will vote for him or approve of his policies.

      I also have to admit that I find it amusing that I didn't see this level of feverish "rejection" when Mr. Trump suddenly began spouting Christian themes and getting "prayed over." If there is any person who has been leveraging religion to further his political ends, it is most certainly that man.
      The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

      I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        So, Buttigieg, as a "practicing Episcopalian" (if, indeed he is one) should oppose abortion "as a means of birth control, family planning, sex selection, or any reason of mere convenience."

        In a series of statements over the past decades, the Church has declared that “we emphatically oppose abortion as a means of birth control, family planning, sex selection, or any reason of mere convenience.” At the same time, since 1967, The Episcopal Church has maintained its “unequivocal opposition to any legislation on the part of the national or state governments which would abridge or deny the right of individuals to reach informed decisions [about the termination of pregnancy] and to act upon them.”


        Yet, what Buttigieg defends abortion right through third trimester, though he also dodges the issue claiming it's "above his pay grade".
        I know many people who are active members of various churches who disagree with some elements of that church's teachings. I was one of them myself - and I was in the seminary studying to be a priest in that particular Christian sect. I'm not sure "disagreeing" is an indicator of nonmembership or nonpracticing.

        That being said - this really is NOT my cup of tea. I'll bow out (other than waiting on Tass' response). Last word to you and Sparko.
        The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

        I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

        Comment


        • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
          I know many people who are active members of various churches who disagree with some elements of that church's teachings. I was one of them myself - and I was in the seminary studying to be a priest in that particular Christian sect. I'm not sure "disagreeing" is an indicator of nonmembership or nonpracticing.

          That being said - this really is NOT my cup of tea. I'll bow out (other than waiting on Tass' response). Last word to you and Sparko.
          Isn't this like the THIRD time you've "bowed out" of this? I'm not done with you yet, Bub!
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
            Personally, I find this entire discussion to be a marvelous example of "right identity politics."
            Of course you do.

            Terms like "cafeteria Christian" and "only being Christian for politic's sake" are, IMO, an attempt to read into a man's inner motivations.
            Which is EXACTLY why I am asking for firsthand statements from Buttigieg himself, because of Tassman's "left identity politics".

            As best I can tell, Buttigieg's life has been closely caught up with his faith.
            He admits his own parents never really attended Church, and he only talks about being "drawn to" the Episcopal church for 'community'.

            I have no idea if he goes to church every Sunday, or otherwise engages with his chosen diocese. I don't actually care. Whether or not he is a "practicing Christian" has no influence on whether or not I will vote for him or approve of his policies.
            For whatever reason, that's what Tassman has been claiming, and I'm simply asking for evidence.

            I also have to admit that I find it amusing that I didn't see this level of feverish "rejection" when Mr. Trump suddenly began spouting Christian themes and getting "prayed over." If there is any person who has been leveraging religion to further his political ends, it is most certainly that man.
            Oh, stow your false indignation, Carpe. I've already commended Tassman on his brilliant observation that Buttigieg and Trump are pretty much alike in this. Nor have I defended Trump's "Christianity" at all.
            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
            I think you may have very unwittingly put Buttigieg in the same category with Trump, and, in a very rare occurrence, I concur.

            Just like Buttigieg, I see no testimony from Trump himself that would indicate that he's a "practicing Christian", and Trump's conduct (particularly prior to becoming POTUS) concerns me a great deal.

            A glaring difference, however, is that Trump seems to be behaving himself with regards to his sexual exploits, while Buttigieg is reveling in his own moral depravity.

            So, yeah, Tassy - you're correct. Buttigieg and Trump have (or had) a lot in common.
            You tend to do this, Carpe --- you let a thread go on and on, then jump in without having read.....

            Yeah, I know, Sparko and I have the last word.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
              Personally, I find this entire discussion to be a marvelous example of "right identity politics." Terms like "cafeteria Christian" and "only being Christian for politic's sake" are, IMO, an attempt to read into a man's inner motivations. As best I can tell, Buttigieg's life has been closely caught up with his faith. I have no idea if he goes to church every Sunday, or otherwise engages with his chosen diocese. I don't actually care. Whether or not he is a "practicing Christian" has no influence on whether or not I will vote for him or approve of his policies.

              I also have to admit that I find it amusing that I didn't see this level of feverish "rejection" when Mr. Trump suddenly began spouting Christian themes and getting "prayed over." If there is any person who has been leveraging religion to further his political ends, it is most certainly that man.
              I believe this is known as "whataboutism."
              I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                It appears that, even IF Buttigieg is an Episcopalian (let alone, a "practicing Christian"), his stance on abortion flies in the face of the Episcopal Church's position even as of last month....

                Summary of General Convention Resolutions on Abortion and Women's Reproductive Health

                So, even though they tend to backpedal on the issue by opposing legislation against abortion, they do declare...

                The Episcopal Church teaches that “all human life is sacred. Hence, it is sacred from its inception until death. The Church takes seriously its obligation to help form the consciences of its members concerning this sacredness. Human life, therefore, should be initiated only advisedly and in full accord with this understanding of the power to conceive and give birth which is bestowed by God.”
                Well he definitely goes against his church then.

                Buttigieg Defends Women’s Right to Third-Trimester Abortions: ‘Who Gets to Draw The Line?’
                https://www.nationalreview.com/news/...draw-the-line/

                Buttigieg supports allowing abortion clinic to temporarily operate in South Bend without license
                https://thehill.com/homenews/state-w...ily-operate-in

                Comment


                • Somebody smack Zym with a fish!

                  Originally posted by Zymologist View Post
                  I believe this is known as "whataboutism."

                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                    Personally, I find this entire discussion to be a marvelous example of "right identity politics." Terms like "cafeteria Christian" and "only being Christian for politic's sake" are, IMO, an attempt to read into a man's inner motivations. As best I can tell, Buttigieg's life has been closely caught up with his faith. I have no idea if he goes to church every Sunday, or otherwise engages with his chosen diocese. I don't actually care. Whether or not he is a "practicing Christian" has no influence on whether or not I will vote for him or approve of his policies.

                    I also have to admit that I find it amusing that I didn't see this level of feverish "rejection" when Mr. Trump suddenly began spouting Christian themes and getting "prayed over." If there is any person who has been leveraging religion to further his political ends, it is most certainly that man.
                    I guess you didn't bother reading this thread then. Because both CP and I said that we don't believe Trump is a "Practicing Christian" either.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                      I know many people who are active members of various churches who disagree with some elements of that church's teachings.....
                      "Some elements"? IT's a freakin' CAMPAIGN ISSUE opposed to a fundamental teaching of his Church on a matter of life and death.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                        I guess you didn't bother reading this thread then. Because both CP and I said that we don't believe Trump is a "Practicing Christian" either.
                        That's one of the things I find disappointing about Carpe - he doesn't bother getting up to speed on an issue that has been debated for pages and pages and pages, then jumps in and promptly stuffs both feet in his mouth.

                        But FEAR NOT!!!! He's leaving the last word to us!

                        Again.
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          Somebody smack Zym with a fish!




                          smiley fish slap.gif

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
                            I also have to admit that I find it amusing that I didn't see this level of feverish "rejection"...
                            Laughing. "Feverish rejection"? Simply asking for a statement from Buttigieg that he, HIMSELF, claims to be a "practicing Christian" is "feverish rejection"?

                            I think you've been to the Tassman school of DramaQueenery, my friend.
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                              Laughing. "Feverish rejection"? Simply asking for a statement from Buttigieg that he, HIMSELF, claims to be a "practicing Christian" is "feverish rejection"?

                              I think you've been to the Tassman school of DramaQueenery, my friend.
                              He is confusing us holding Tassman's feet to the fire to back up HIS CLAIM that Buttigieg is a "Practicing Christian" with us saying Buttigieg is not a Christian. We never said he wasn't, we are just asking Tassman to back up his claim that he IS a "Practicing Christian"

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                                He is confusing us holding Tassman's feet to the fire to back up HIS CLAIM that Buttigieg is a "Practicing Christian" with us saying Buttigieg is not a Christian. We never said he wasn't, we are just asking Tassman to back up his claim that he IS a "Practicing Christian"
                                If Christianity were illegal, and Buttigieg were put on trial for being a Christian, he would be immediately exonerated due to lack of evidence. Everything brought against him would be highly speculative.
                                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                                Comment

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