Mayor Pete Attacks Trump's Faith...

[Cow Poke]

But I am simply refuse to accept CP’s assessment that Buttigieg in not a Christian...

First (in this post) Tassmanian Lie. I have NEVER said that Buttigieg is not a Christian. I don't believe you'll find me EVER declaring somebody "not a Christian".

when he clearly states that he is.

Second (in this post) Tassmanian Lie. You have yet to show EVEN ONCE where Buttigieg "states that he is" a "practicing Christian". There's not even a single reference on his official website to his salvation, his Christianity, his faith, his Church....

And I’ve posted several links that spell out exactly that.

Third (in this post) Tassmanian Lie. All you've done is post some nonsense that you INTERPRET to mean he's a "practicing Christian". (Did you forget that was your claim?) All I'm asking you to do is back that up with a statement from Buttigieg himself. Or, at least, some convincing evidence.

CP is always “mad”. He’s an angry, judgmental Christian.

Says the anti-Christian bigot who comes here for no other purpose that to be a pain in the butt to Christians.

(You obviously won't see the irony in you angrily judging me "an angry, judgmental Christian". Sounds a bit anti-Christian bigotry, given my THOUSANDS of posts here where I am anything BUT angry!)

[JimL]

hey Jim, why don't you send me 50% of your money? Wouldn't YOU like to receive 50% of other people's money? Say like, Elon Musk? so, according to the golden rule, you need to send me half of your money (or more!) - just send it paypal to [email protected]

[Mountain Man]

hey Jim, why don't you send me 50% of your money? Wouldn't YOU like to receive 50% of other people's money? Say like, Elon Musk? so, according to the golden rule, you need to send me half of your money (or more!) - just send it paypal to [email protected]

Like Obama once said, "We all need to reach deep into our pockets and give to those less fortunate. You go first!"

Or there's the other version of the Golden Rule recited by a young boy in my mom's Sunday school class: "Lord, forgive me for what I'm fixin' to do."

[One Bad Pig]

Yes, I remember. You were in denial about just how very late some of the crucial NT texts were. Enjoyable discussion.

This nearly looks like a deliberate deflection, as that's been a minor component (as in, so minor I don't recall the details of that particular conversation) of what we've discussed regarding church history, and appears to be an attempt to put ME on the defensive.

Well I'm trying.

Bovine faeces, as Roy likes to say.

But I am simply refuse to accept CP’s assessment that Buttigieg in not a Christian when he clearly states that he is. And I’ve posted several links that spell out exactly that.

No, you haven't - as CP has addressed.

CP is always “mad”. He’s an angry, judgmental Christian.

You know better than that, too. Fail harder, bro.

[Cow Poke]

So, this gets more interesting.

Apparently, Buttigieg's partner, Chasten, has a brother who is a pastor.

Chasten has been talking about the rejection he received when he "came out", and how his own family disowned him. Chasten's own brother, a Pastor, says that is a completely false narrative, and could not be further from the truth.

(I'm trying to find sources for this that are not locked behind paywalls - here is one with limited information)

However, during a recently published interview with The Washington Post, Buttigieg’s husband Chasten opened up about his own sexual identity and his family’s struggle — partially for religious reasons — to accept his orientation.

One of Chasten’s brothers, Rhyan Glezman, who is a pastor at a church in Clio, Michigan, told the Post he was not surprised by his youngest brother’s homosexuality.

“I want the best for him,” he told the newspaper, noting it was very difficult for the family to make amends with Chasten’s sexuality. “I just don’t support the gay lifestyle.”

Buttigieg, the mayor of South Bend, Indiana, identifies as an Episcopalian. He has, perhaps as a result of the media’s prompting, made his sexual orientation a cornerstone of his campaign.

Here's another perspective on that story...

Standing in the living room of his home — the same space in which he recently led his middle brother Dustin to Christ — Rhyan Glezman, brother-in-law to Pete Buttigieg, lamented the “unfortunate” way a journalist for The Washington Post crafted a recent story that made him seem “homophobic.”

Several weeks ago, sitting in his office at Clio Community Church in Michigan, Rhyan said his phone rang. It was a reporter from the Post eager to talk with him about his brother Chasten’s marriage to the popular 2020 Democratic presidential hopeful.

“I actually talked with them for about 35-40 minutes, shared the whole story,” Rhyan, a pastor, told Faithwire during a phone interview Thursday afternoon. “They took a couple little quotes out of that whole 40 minutes and it obviously was to fit their narrative, just to be honest.”

The 34-year-old minister, who told the Post he is opposed to same-sex marriage, said he felt like the journalist, Ellen McCarthy, was trying to make him come across to readers “like a bigot.”

Rhyan reached out to Faithwire Thursday morning, asking to “talk about the full story that the Washington Post left out.” And according to him, the story the outlet “left out” is quite different from the one McCarthy wrote.

While Chasten recalled to McCarthy a journey fraught with alienation and shame, Rhyan remembers something entirely different. The 29-year-old political spouse said there was a lot of judgement when he came out as gay to his family, claiming to remember one of his brothers uttering, “No brother of mine …” during the conversation with his mom and dad, both of whom are nominally Catholic and were, according to Rhyan, very accepting of Chasten’s orientation. Chasten told McCarthy his parents eventually embraced him.

“That was a long time ago, but that’s not what I would say. That’s not my character, that’s not my brother’s character,” Rhyan said. “Nobody ever rejected him at all. … I would say they embraced him even deeper.”

Chasten also told the Post he was homeless for a season — a claim Rhyan vehemently rebuffed, saying his brother was “never, ever” rejected.

FAITHWIRE Democratic Presidential Candidate Says Pro-Life Laws Are ‘Against Christian Faith’

So if Chasten felt any level of discomfort or fear over telling his family about his sexual orientation, Rhyan said, it was his own feelings, not “because anyone made him feel that way.”

“I think that’s the Spirit of God and I think the Spirit talks, even when people aren’t filled with the Holy Spirit,” he explained, “because we were created in his image with his conscience.”
What does Rhyan really think?

While the article in the Post makes it sound like Rhyan, who has received a ton of hate mail since the story was published, has struggled to move past his youngest brother’s sexual orientation, the Michigan-based pastor revealed he has hosted Chasten’s previous partners in his home, took him on an all-expenses-paid trip to Six Flags in Illinois for his 21st birthday, got a cross tattoo at his brother’s request (Chasten never followed through on his end of the bargain), and even attended a baseball game in South Bend, Indiana, with Chasten and Pete before they got married in November of last year.

“I love my brother dearly. He’s my brother. That’s never gonna change,” Rhyan said, noting he often sends Chasten text messages with encouraging Bible verses, though the two haven’t talked in a while.

Rhyan’s issue is not solely with Chasten’s homosexuality. His main concern, he explained, is the “neglect of Christ” in his brother’s life and the fact that, in his view, Pete is building a presidential campaign on a “false narrative,” again noting his family was “very welcoming” of Chasten’s lifestyle.

In fact, according to Rhyan, the only members of his family who have faced rejection are those who have turned to the Christian faith. For his part, Rhyan, who came to Jesus after his own battle with drinking, hasn’t even spoken with his parents much in the last year.

While I still can't find any evidence whatsoever that Buttigieg claims, himself, to be a Christian, much less a "practicing Christian" as Tassman so frequently claimed, his own brother-in-law sees Buttigieg's campaign as being built on a "false narrative".

[Cow Poke]

WOW, This just in.... Robert C Bordone, a Clinical Professor of Law at Harvard Law School, writes in an article defending Buttigieg's "faith"....

Like Mayor Pete, I was a bit of a late bloomer, coming out at the age of 30. Many factors held me back, including the official teaching of my Catholic faith, perceived family expectations and my own fears that being gay would deprive me of a host of professional and personal aspirations. Like Mayor Pete, I did all I could do to deny my reality and make dating women work.

In the intervening years since coming out, I have reconciled my faith with my sexuality and been fortunate enough to find a local Catholic community that supports me fully for who I am, as someone who, in the words of Psalm 139, is “fearfully and wonderfully made.”

As I have stated, Buttigieg doesn't "interpret" scripture to justify his defiance of biblical teaching - he simply ignores the relevant passages. THIS GUY, Bordone, goes one step further, in ripping a verse out of context, and WHAT CONTEXT IS THAT?

The very passage that pro-lifers often cite to show that we are "persons" in our mother's womb....

Scripture Verse: Psalm 139

13 For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb.
14 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them.

© Copyright Original Source

So, in an idiotic attempt to prove "God made Pete that way", Bordone rips a phrase out of a passage that condemns Buttigieg's "the beginning of human life is unknowable" idiocy.

“For those who have a strong view about some of these almost unknowable questions around life, the best answer I can give, is that because we will never be able to settle those questions, in a consensus fashion,” he said in response to a question about abortion limits.

So, "Practicing Christian Pete" was "fearfully and wonderfully made" by God, knitted together in his mother's womb, with his unformed substance written down in God's book, but the beginning of human life is "unknowable"...

I wonder if Bordone even has a clue that he just condemned Buttigieg's very pro-abortion activism.

[tabibito]

Yes, I remember. You were in denial about just how very late some of the crucial NT texts were. Enjoyable discussion.

As I recall, you never made a sound argument on that issue.

Well I'm trying. But I am simply refuse to accept CP’s assessment that Buttigieg in not a Christian when he clearly states that he is. And I’ve posted several links that spell out exactly that.

No. That was me - or did I actually post that assessment?

[Cow Poke]

No. That was me - or did I actually post that assessment?

Maybe, but...

A) I have never stated Buttigieg is not a Christian
2) Tassman has never once posted anything that shows that Buttigieg himself claims that he is.

To be clear - I don't think anybody will find me declare somebody is NOT a Christian if they claim to be, but when they make no such claim, and there is no 'fruit', I have every reason - even an obligation - to ask.

[JimL]

So, this gets more interesting.

Apparently, Buttigieg's partner, Chasten, has a brother who is a pastor.

Chasten has been talking about the rejection he received when he "came out", and how his own family disowned him. Chasten's own brother, a Pastor, says that is a completely false narrative, and could not be further from the truth.

(I'm trying to find sources for this that are not locked behind paywalls - here is one with limited information)

However, during a recently published interview with The Washington Post, Buttigieg’s husband Chasten opened up about his own sexual identity and his family’s struggle — partially for religious reasons — to accept his orientation.

One of Chasten’s brothers, Rhyan Glezman, who is a pastor at a church in Clio, Michigan, told the Post he was not surprised by his youngest brother’s homosexuality.

“I want the best for him,” he told the newspaper, noting it was very difficult for the family to make amends with Chasten’s sexuality. “I just don’t support the gay lifestyle.”

Buttigieg, the mayor of South Bend, Indiana, identifies as an Episcopalian. He has, perhaps as a result of the media’s prompting, made his sexual orientation a cornerstone of his campaign.

Here's another perspective on that story...

Standing in the living room of his home — the same space in which he recently led his middle brother Dustin to Christ — Rhyan Glezman, brother-in-law to Pete Buttigieg, lamented the “unfortunate” way a journalist for The Washington Post crafted a recent story that made him seem “homophobic.”

Several weeks ago, sitting in his office at Clio Community Church in Michigan, Rhyan said his phone rang. It was a reporter from the Post eager to talk with him about his brother Chasten’s marriage to the popular 2020 Democratic presidential hopeful.

“I actually talked with them for about 35-40 minutes, shared the whole story,” Rhyan, a pastor, told Faithwire during a phone interview Thursday afternoon. “They took a couple little quotes out of that whole 40 minutes and it obviously was to fit their narrative, just to be honest.”

The 34-year-old minister, who told the Post he is opposed to same-sex marriage, said he felt like the journalist, Ellen McCarthy, was trying to make him come across to readers “like a bigot.”

Rhyan reached out to Faithwire Thursday morning, asking to “talk about the full story that the Washington Post left out.” And according to him, the story the outlet “left out” is quite different from the one McCarthy wrote.

While Chasten recalled to McCarthy a journey fraught with alienation and shame, Rhyan remembers something entirely different. The 29-year-old political spouse said there was a lot of judgement when he came out as gay to his family, claiming to remember one of his brothers uttering, “No brother of mine …” during the conversation with his mom and dad, both of whom are nominally Catholic and were, according to Rhyan, very accepting of Chasten’s orientation. Chasten told McCarthy his parents eventually embraced him.

“That was a long time ago, but that’s not what I would say. That’s not my character, that’s not my brother’s character,” Rhyan said. “Nobody ever rejected him at all. … I would say they embraced him even deeper.”

Chasten also told the Post he was homeless for a season — a claim Rhyan vehemently rebuffed, saying his brother was “never, ever” rejected.

FAITHWIRE Democratic Presidential Candidate Says Pro-Life Laws Are ‘Against Christian Faith’

So if Chasten felt any level of discomfort or fear over telling his family about his sexual orientation, Rhyan said, it was his own feelings, not “because anyone made him feel that way.”

“I think that’s the Spirit of God and I think the Spirit talks, even when people aren’t filled with the Holy Spirit,” he explained, “because we were created in his image with his conscience.”
What does Rhyan really think?

While the article in the Post makes it sound like Rhyan, who has received a ton of hate mail since the story was published, has struggled to move past his youngest brother’s sexual orientation, the Michigan-based pastor revealed he has hosted Chasten’s previous partners in his home, took him on an all-expenses-paid trip to Six Flags in Illinois for his 21st birthday, got a cross tattoo at his brother’s request (Chasten never followed through on his end of the bargain), and even attended a baseball game in South Bend, Indiana, with Chasten and Pete before they got married in November of last year.

“I love my brother dearly. He’s my brother. That’s never gonna change,” Rhyan said, noting he often sends Chasten text messages with encouraging Bible verses, though the two haven’t talked in a while.

Rhyan’s issue is not solely with Chasten’s homosexuality. His main concern, he explained, is the “neglect of Christ” in his brother’s life and the fact that, in his view, Pete is building a presidential campaign on a “false narrative,” again noting his family was “very welcoming” of Chasten’s lifestyle.

In fact, according to Rhyan, the only members of his family who have faced rejection are those who have turned to the Christian faith. For his part, Rhyan, who came to Jesus after his own battle with drinking, hasn’t even spoken with his parents much in the last year.

While I still can't find any evidence whatsoever that Buttigieg claims, himself, to be a Christian, much less a "practicing Christian" as Tassman so frequently claimed, his own brother-in-law sees Buttigieg's campaign as being built on a "false narrative".

And we are supposed to care about what Chastens brother might think, why?

[JimL]

WOW, This just in.... Robert C Bordone, a Clinical Professor of Law at Harvard Law School, writes in an article defending Buttigieg's "faith"....

Like Mayor Pete, I was a bit of a late bloomer, coming out at the age of 30. Many factors held me back, including the official teaching of my Catholic faith, perceived family expectations and my own fears that being gay would deprive me of a host of professional and personal aspirations. Like Mayor Pete, I did all I could do to deny my reality and make dating women work.

In the intervening years since coming out, I have reconciled my faith with my sexuality and been fortunate enough to find a local Catholic community that supports me fully for who I am, as someone who, in the words of Psalm 139, is “fearfully and wonderfully made.”

As I have stated, Buttigieg doesn't "interpret" scripture to justify his defiance of biblical teaching - he simply ignores the relevant passages. THIS GUY, Bordone, goes one step further, in ripping a verse out of context, and WHAT CONTEXT IS THAT?

The very passage that pro-lifers often cite to show that we are "persons" in our mother's womb....

Scripture Verse: Psalm 139

13 For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb.
14 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them.

© Copyright Original Source

So, in an idiotic attempt to prove "God made Pete that way", Bordone rips a phrase out of a passage that condemns Buttigieg's "the beginning of human life is unknowable" idiocy.

“For those who have a strong view about some of these almost unknowable questions around life, the best answer I can give, is that because we will never be able to settle those questions, in a consensus fashion,” he said in response to a question about abortion limits.

So, "Practicing Christian Pete" was "fearfully and wonderfully made" by God, knitted together in his mother's womb, with his unformed substance written down in God's book, but the beginning of human life is "unknowable"...

I wonder if Bordone even has a clue that he just condemned Buttigieg's very pro-abortion activism.

Buttigieg claims to be Episcopalian, and he credits god for his sexual orientation. That is a person who believes in god, a creator, and who is a member of a christian church. give it up, CP.

[Cow Poke]

Buttigieg claims to be Episcopalian,

So? I know people who claim to be lots of things, but he never claims - that I have found - that he's a Christian. Somebody can claim a religious denomination without being a Christian.

and he credits god for his sexual orientation.

Based on what scripture? The same scripture that condemns his extremist views on abortion?

That is a person who believes in god, a creator, and who is a member of a christian church.

None of which makes a person a Christian.

give it up, CP.

Just show me where Buttigieg actually claims to be a Christian, rather than being proclaimed one by a couple of anti-Christian bigots using incredibly inept arguments.

[tabibito]

Maybe, but...

A) I have never stated Buttigieg is not a Christian
2) Tassman has never once posted anything that shows that Buttigieg himself claims that he is.

To be clear - I don't think anybody will find me declare somebody is NOT a Christian if they claim to be, but when they make no such claim, and there is no 'fruit', I have every reason - even an obligation - to ask.

Buttigieg's own comments maybe don't make an explicit claim - but they are tailored so as to make the implication.

ETA

Having just noticed that bit about him claiming to be Episcopalian ... but they are very strongly tailored so as to make that implication.

[Cow Poke]

Buttigieg's own comments maybe don't make an explicit claim - but they are tailored so as to make the implication.

ETA

Having just noticed that bit about him claiming to be Episcopalian ... but they are very strongly tailored so as to make that implication.

Tassman's entire screed has been that Buttigieg is a "practicing Christian", and that Buttigieg made that claim himself. I don't even find anywhere that Buttigieg claims, himself, to be an Episcopalian, but that he kinda was drawn to that "faith community" because of their acceptance.

What's your strongest evidence that Buttigieg himself claims to be a Christian?

[Mountain Man]

Maybe, but...

A) I have never stated Buttigieg is not a Christian
2) Tassman has never once posted anything that shows that Buttigieg himself claims that he is.

To be clear - I don't think anybody will find me declare somebody is NOT a Christian if they claim to be, but when they make no such claim, and there is no 'fruit', I have every reason - even an obligation - to ask.

I can accept that someone is a Christian but is not living according to the Bible. God knows there are plenty of times in my life when I fit that description.

[Cow Poke]

I can accept that someone is a Christian but is not living according to the Bible. God knows there are plenty of times in my life when I fit that description.

Sure - but when a person never claims to be a Christian in the first place, and chooses a lifestyle that places themselves in direct violation of the teachings of the Bible...