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Thread: Is suicide a sin if the person is not mentally competent to be responsible?

  1. #21
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    That's about the silliest thig I ever heard. Telling the person that is suffering that they a selfish because they choose to no longer suffer.
    A) He never said anything about telling the person who is suffering anything at all. Many times, we don't know anything about this until they're already dead.
    2) Not all suicides are because of unbearable pain. There are actually suicides committed out of spite, defiance, hatred, drama...

    source
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  2. Amen mossrose, Cerebrum123 amen'd this post.
  3. #22
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimLamebrain View Post
    That's about the silliest thig I ever heard. Telling the person that is suffering that they a selfish because they choose to no longer suffer.



    When you are suffering bad enough to want to end it all, then you can talk about how much you take others into consideration.
    Right, and where's his concern for the family and friends who will have to spend the rest of their life dealing with the heartache of knowing that someone they loved killed himself? It's one of the most purely selfish acts imaginable.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  4. #23
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    A) He never said anything about telling the person who is suffering anything at all. Many times, we don't know anything about this until they're already dead.
    He's telling them now, while their alive, that alleviating their own suffering is selfish because they aren't taking others feelings into consideration.

    2) Not all suicides are because of unbearable pain. There are actually suicides committed out of spite, defiance, hatred, drama...

    source
    Some perhaps, but not most, and even those are a call for help. No sane person is going to kill themselves simply out of spite or hatred etc. People don't want to die. There is obviously a lot more going on there than meets the eye in such cases.

  5. #24
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Right, and where's his concern for the family and friends who will have to spend the rest of their life dealing with the heartache of knowing that someone they loved killed himself? It's one of the most purely selfish acts imaginable.
    When you are in suffering severely enough to want to take your own life, then tell us how much the feelings of others concern you.

  6. #25
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimLamebrain View Post
    When you are in suffering severely enough to want to take your own life, then tell us how much the feelings of others concern you.
    Exactly. You're only thinking of yourself with no regard for others. That is the very definition of selfishness.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  7. #26
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    He's telling them now, while their alive, that alleviating their own suffering is selfish because they aren't taking others feelings into consideration.


    Some perhaps, but not most, and even those are a call for help. No sane person is going to kill themselves simply out of spite or hatred etc. People don't want to die. There is obviously a lot more going on there than meets the eye in such cases.
    I see you're as good an expert on this as you are on the law... and grammar.
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    tWebber Tassman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    A)
    2) Not all suicides are because of unbearable pain. There are actually suicides committed out of spite, defiance, hatred, drama...

    source
    Such suicides are accidental. The intention is to manipulate, not to actually die.
    “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

  9. #28
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tassman View Post
    Such suicides are accidental. The intention is to manipulate, not to actually die.
    In many cases, yes, but not always.
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  10. #29
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    A) He never said anything about telling the person who is suffering anything at all. Many times, we don't know anything about this until they're already dead.
    2) Not all suicides are because of unbearable pain. There are actually suicides committed out of spite, defiance, hatred, drama...

    source
    . . . and mental illness.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  11. #30
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Mental illness is is no different than physical illness, the suffering can be just as bad. Again, people don't commit suicide because they want to die, they commit suicide because they are in pain and come to see suicide as a last resort. At any rate, no one can say that it is wrong, or that it is a sin, because no one else is in the shoes if the victim. Some times people just want to end their suffering, but more often than not, suicide, or attempted suicide, is a call for help from those who know of no other way to get help. But why on earth would anyone believe that ones final solution to their suffering to be a sin? They are not fulfilling a desire, they don't want to die, they are just trying to put an end to their suffering in the only way they believe they can.
    I believe there is too much rationalization here of hypothetical reasons why the mental illness results in suicide. One of the problems with some kinds of mental illness is the victims of suicide most often cannot rationalize the reasons for commiting suicide as you do above.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

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