Standing up for the poor invites the Antichrist?

[KingsGambit]

I had an exchange with another Christian today and I'm not sure why, but I'm really upset about this.

This person was ranting about how the Southern Baptist Convention had been taken over by socialists pushing social justice. My stance is that the Bible does call for social justice - Micah and Amos specifically focused on the issue. This isn't "social justice" in the same sense that most modern liberals meant, but it does mean looking out for the poor and their being exploited, and it does mean looking out for widows in need. I made this point, making clear that I was not interested in modern liberalism's social justice.

The response? These passages aren't really about social justice, they're about obeying God, and they're only there in the first place because Israel was a theocracy. Paul never mentions social justice, therefore, Christians must stay away from it, and in fact, involvement in any social justice leads to the one world government of Romans 13 and invites the Antichrist.

I think this is nonsense, personally. However, I wonder if this mindset is why some Christians seem not to care about the poor. Does anybody else here subscribe to this, or know anybody who does?

(And, yes, I'm intentionally posting this in a Christian only area.(

[lee_merrill]

[Cerebrum123]

Sounds very reactionary, and very stupid. I'm all for actual justice in society, problem is the phrase has been hijacked by some to mean their pet programs. This person seems to have an aversion the phrase even when its clear that is not in view. With someone like that all I can do is and move on.

[Cow Poke]

I think it's reflecting a lot of what some of us in SBC leadership have been experiencing....

There was a time when I kinda thought that the "social gospel" churches were a bunch of liberals straying from the Truth, and it was critical to "stay true to the Word"....

Over the last 20 or 30 years, I became more and more convinced that, in our case, it doesn't have to be an "either or". We can be 'True to the Word', *AND* do the "social gospel stuff". That's why my church has a semi-annual car clinic for people who need that kind of help, and the Jobs for Life program, and the food pantry...

So, we preach the Gospel without apology, and stay involved in the community in any way that makes sense.

[Cow Poke]

So, KG, what, specifically, is the SBC doing that irritates this guy? And is there a corresponding 'watering down of the Gospel' accusation?

[KingsGambit]

So, KG, what, specifically, is the SBC doing that irritates this guy? And is there a corresponding 'watering down of the Gospel' accusation?

He didn't offer specifics - just the usual names - Russell Moore and Al Mohler giving into socialism and, yes, watering down the gospel.

I'm not aware of either of these two men actually endorsing socialism. I suspect he just means "socialism" in the sense of "anything I disagree with".

I think I've expressed on here in the past why I could never join the SBC, but this seems like slander.

[Cow Poke]

He didn't offer specifics - just the usual names - Russell Moore and Al Mohler giving into socialism and, yes, watering down the gospel.

I'm not aware of either of these two men actually endorsing socialism. I suspect he just means "socialism" in the sense of "anything I disagree with".

I think I've expressed on here in the past why I could never join the SBC, but this seems like slander.

I know that there are those who are upset that the SBC is taking a hard look at our own sexual misconduct problems, and as we've been discussing in another thread, doing our best to get beyond the stain of slavery.... I know a few right wing extremists who are upset with that, but so far, I like our direction.

[lee_merrill]

Dr. Brown urges both bringing people to salvation and social action...

Blessings,
Lee

[Terraceth]

I think I've expressed on here in the past why I could never join the SBC, but this seems like slander.

Could you express it again? I was curious and searched through your past posts but did not see anything about it.

As for the general topic, I'm reminded of this post I stumbled across a while ago:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/adrian...ocial-justice/

[KingsGambit]

Could you express it again? I was curious and searched through your past posts but did not see anything about it.

As for the general topic, I'm reminded of this post I stumbled across a while ago:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/adrian...ocial-justice/

My grandmother is openly racist and justifies it solely on religious grounds. She says she learned it in church, and her lifelong denomination is SBC.

[Cow Poke]

My grandmother is openly racist and justifies it solely on religious grounds. She says she learned it in church, and her lifelong denomination is SBC.

Yeah, because of the foundational principle of "autonomy of the local church", SBC churches come in all flavors, depending on their local leadership. A congregation is free to choose their own pastor, so if you have a 'controlling faction', they can pretty much dictate the future of the church (and its theology/philosophy) by the kind of pastor they call.

[ReformedApologist]

As a Southern Baptist myself, I am irritated at some of the attitudes people have towards the SBC concerning that. They accuse people about not seeing the gospel message as important, they call anyone who stands up for social justice as a Marxist and other slanderous names. Jesus did say we are to preach the gospel, but we also are called to alleviate sufferings of the poor when we are able (Proverbs 31:8-9; Galatians 2:10; James 2:2-4; Matthew 25:35-40; 1st John 3:17-18). Some people just want to pit one against the other for some reason.

[Sparko]

I think it's reflecting a lot of what some of us in SBC leadership have been experiencing....

There was a time when I kinda thought that the "social gospel" churches were a bunch of liberals straying from the Truth, and it was critical to "stay true to the Word"....

Over the last 20 or 30 years, I became more and more convinced that, in our case, it doesn't have to be an "either or". We can be 'True to the Word', *AND* do the "social gospel stuff". That's why my church has a semi-annual car clinic for people who need that kind of help, and the Jobs for Life program, and the food pantry...

So, we preach the Gospel without apology, and stay involved in the community in any way that makes sense.

That's pretty much my take. The church is to take care of those in need whether rich or poor or middle class. Visit the elderly, help out widows and orphans, feed the hungry. The bible commands us to do this. But what people today call "social justice" is more about justifying sinfulness or even just silly stuff, like protesting milk and eggs.

And WE are supposed to be doing it voluntarily, out of love, not because we are being forced to do it, or our money is taken away from us to be done by others.

[Cow Poke]

That's pretty much my take. The church is to take care of those in need whether rich or poor or middle class. Visit the elderly, help out widows and orphans, feed the hungry. The bible commands us to do this. But what people today call "social justice" is more about justifying sinfulness or even just silly stuff, like protesting milk and eggs.

And WE are supposed to be doing it voluntarily, out of love, not because we are being forced to do it, or our money is taken away from us to be done by others.

On the same hand, we need to be good stewards with God's money, so that doesn't mean 'enabling' the poor who will not work. There are actually biblical commands forbidding that.

As we've discussed in the past, I'd rather 'accidentally' help somebody who doesn't deserve it, than accidentally not help somebody who really needs it. A little due diligence is key.

(Good to see you back in the saddle, even though you're not sitting up exactly straight yet )

[KingsGambit]

But what people today call "social justice" is more about justifying sinfulness or even just silly stuff, like protesting milk and eggs.
.

I specifically said I didn't have that in mind, though.