Page 2 of 8 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 76

Thread: A Victory for Female Athletes Everywhere

  1. #11
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Triangle
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    10,266
    Amen (Given)
    1677
    Amen (Received)
    4508
    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    Probably. Since the prevaling wind is to define sex based on something other than one's dna and/or birth sex organs, finding a clear marker that can be used to differentiate sport is harder.

    Jim
    Sex organs alone probably aren't a viable solution because of intersex outliers, right?
    "Technology has, in an enhanced way, given mockers a platform to set society on fire with polarizing speech. Internet culture privileges those whose insults are click bait." - Timothy Keller

  2. #12
    tWebber seer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    New England
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    24,410
    Amen (Given)
    1642
    Amen (Received)
    4919
    Quote Originally Posted by Terraceth View Post
    Possibly because "the sex you were born with" becomes a thorny issue when it comes to the intersex, because how do you set a definitive standard as to whether they count as male or female for the purpose of sports? Testosterone, on the other hand, is an objective measurement.
    Yes for the intersex you could use T levels.

    Another issue with "the sex you were born with" is that while that while it works for preventing men from having an unfair advantage by competing in women's sports, it means that female-to-male transsexuals are still put with the females even while taking testosterone, granting a drug-induced advantage. The testosterone standard therefore puts those individuals into the male bracket rather than essentially putting females against steroid-enhanced females.
    Again in those cases, like with the intersex, we could use T levels but as a general policy we would stick with biology.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

  3. #13
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Maryland
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,973
    Amen (Given)
    278
    Amen (Received)
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Sex organs alone probably aren't a viable solution because of intersex outliers, right?
    Seems you would just need a policy for those rare cases where more than one sex organ is present.

    Jim
    He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  4. #14
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    United States
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    16,501
    Amen (Given)
    5567
    Amen (Received)
    5789
    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Based on this particular reasoning, shouldn't Michael Phelps have been kicked out of the Olympics because his body produces half the lactic acid of other competitors?

    I feel bad for this athlete. She isn't transgender or anything; she just happens to have a weird medical situation going on.
    Is the amount of lactic acid in the body a defining characteristic of gender like testosterone? It's not about stopping people with a natural physical advantage from competing, it's to stop men from calling themselves women and having an absurdly unfair advantage in women's sporta.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  5. Amen oxmixmudd amen'd this post.
  6. #15
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Triangle
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    10,266
    Amen (Given)
    1677
    Amen (Received)
    4508
    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Is the amount of lactic acid in the body a defining characteristic of gender like testosterone? It's not about stopping people with a natural physical advantage from competing, it's to stop men from calling themselves women and having an absurdly unfair advantage in women's sporta.
    No. But this particular athlete isn't trying to do that either. She isn't one of the men trying to pretend to be women, which there do seem to be a number of out there.

    I don't think there's any really good solution in this case, though.
    "Technology has, in an enhanced way, given mockers a platform to set society on fire with polarizing speech. Internet culture privileges those whose insults are click bait." - Timothy Keller

  7. #16
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Maryland
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,973
    Amen (Given)
    278
    Amen (Received)
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    No. But this particular athlete isn't trying to do that either. She isn't one of the men trying to pretend to be women, which there do seem to be a number of out there.

    I don't think there's any really good solution in this case, though.
    She is a victim of the idiots trying to say it makes sense to let people that are physically men compete against women in sports.

    Jim
    Last edited by oxmixmudd; 05-05-2019 at 08:20 PM.
    He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  8. #17
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Maryland
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,973
    Amen (Given)
    278
    Amen (Received)
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    No. But this particular athlete isn't trying to do that either. She isn't one of the men trying to pretend to be women, which there do seem to be a number of out there.

    I don't think there's any really good solution in this case, though.
    But there is. Just recognize that anyone with a natural body that is male can't compte against people with natural bodies that are female. I mean sports, especially professional sports, is all about being gifted with a very rare set of physical capabilities. So it is already exclusive, and if you dont have the natural body that allows you to compete, tough. That is why we dont just let everyone dope themselves into supercompetitors. You compete based on your natural gifts plus your hard work.

    Jim
    Last edited by oxmixmudd; 05-05-2019 at 08:21 PM.
    He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  9. #18
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    49,202
    Amen (Given)
    4895
    Amen (Received)
    21819
    This still isn't a fair solution. Even if a transwoman has had the operation and has testosterone levels in the correct range, when she was a he she had all of the growth benefits of testosterone. She would still have a man's frame and muscles even if they had atrophied a bit because of lack of testosterone.

    I believe if a sport has a gender specific category, then it should only allow genetically matched genders into that category. So a female only sport should be for those born as female who have female DNA. Why is it so hard for them to just say that? The whole reason we have female only leagues is to allow women to compete in sports where men would normally dominate. To allow any sort of former male into the league defeats the entire purpose.

  10. Amen RumTumTugger, DesertBerean amen'd this post.
  11. #19
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    53,716
    Amen (Given)
    11690
    Amen (Received)
    24948
    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Based on this particular reasoning, shouldn't Michael Phelps have been kicked out of the Olympics because his body produces half the lactic acid of other competitors?

    I feel bad for this athlete. She isn't transgender or anything; she just happens to have a weird medical situation going on.
    Thanks for pointing that out, KG -- it's making me look deeper into this.
    Every problem is the result of a previous solution.

  12. #20
    tWebber
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Maryland
    Faith
    Christian
    Gender
    Male
    Posts
    4,973
    Amen (Given)
    278
    Amen (Received)
    1500
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    This still isn't a fair solution. Even if a transwoman has had the operation and has testosterone levels in the correct range, when she was a he she had all of the growth benefits of testosterone. She would still have a man's frame and muscles even if they had atrophied a bit because of lack of testosterone.

    I believe if a sport has a gender specific category, then it should only allow genetically matched genders into that category. So a female only sport should be for those born as female who have female DNA. Why is it so hard for them to just say that? The whole reason we have female only leagues is to allow women to compete in sports where men would normally dominate. To allow any sort of former male into the league defeats the entire purpose.
    I do not know why the concept is so difficult to grasp for some. but some people can't accept who they are and they want the rest of the world to adjust and acknowledge they are what they want to be, regardless of whether or not that is a fantasy or reality. This aspect of the LBGTQ movement (TQ) is just bonkers to me. And it seems contrary to the mantra - accept me for who I am. Well your body is male whether that is what you want to be or not. Get over it!

    Jim
    He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •