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Thread: Patriarch Kirill

  1. #11
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    yeah that was kind of the whole point of the Darpanet that it was based on, a decentralized network that could survive even a nuclear war.

    Of course now we have some backbone servers that would put a severe dent in the internet if someone were to take them down. And the nameservers. But it would be near impossible to take the whole thing down. or control it.
    And it's kind of a spy-vs-spy thing --- somebody will come up with a way to make a dent, somebody else will figure out a way around it.

    (I still think that most viruses are created by the anti-virus people to sell more product!!!! )
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  2. Amen Sparko amen'd this post.
  3. #12
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terraceth View Post
    When/where was it condemned? I looked it up and it seems like it lost a lot of popularity around that time, but not that it was really condemned by a council or anything. Or are you just referring to Augustine and Jerome's opposition?
    At the Second Ecumenical Council:

    Source: Orthodox Dogmatic Theology

    If it was at one time possible to express chiliastic ideas as private opinions, this was only until the Ecumenical Church expressed its judgment about this. But when the Second Ecumenical Council (381), in condemning all the errors of the heretic Apollinarius, condemned also his teaching of the thousand-year reign of Christ and introduced into the very Symbol of Faith the words concerning Christ: And His Kingdom will have no end—it became no longer permissible at all for an Orthodox Christian to hold these opinions....

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  4. #13
    tWebber
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    Look into A.I. and bitcoin as a precursor to a beast-like control grid. Throw in 5G and it's a heady mix of doom. Skynet anyone?

  5. #14
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    At the Second Ecumenical Council:

    Source: Orthodox Dogmatic Theology

    If it was at one time possible to express chiliastic ideas as private opinions, this was only until the Ecumenical Church expressed its judgment about this. But when the Second Ecumenical Council (381), in condemning all the errors of the heretic Apollinarius, condemned also his teaching of the thousand-year reign of Christ and introduced into the very Symbol of Faith the words concerning Christ: And His Kingdom will have no end—it became no longer permissible at all for an Orthodox Christian to hold these opinions....

    © Copyright Original Source


    source
    Hrm... where did the Second Ecumenical Council (a.k.a. First Council of Constantinople) condemn chiliasm? I looked at the canons of the Second Ecumenical Council and I see no condemnation of a thousand-year reign of Christ, not even in the disputed canons. It does mention Apollinarius, but only as part of a list of heretics without going into any detail as to what his heresy was. It's far more likely this was a reference to his Christological beliefs than anything else, given that from what I can tell, that was what he was most known (and criticized) for. Perhaps they also took a dim view of his chiliasm, but to use the Council as evidence of chiliasm condemnation is simply reading assumptions into the text.

  6. #15
    Child of the One True King Raphael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    If you can get the major search engines on board, you can control things pretty well. China's internet is pretty well locked down, for example, and Google is pretty adept at burying sources they don't like, as has been shown here before.
    Both the UK Govt and the NZ Govt are looking at even blocking things like Facebook if they allow people to post "extremist content" the problem is that whilst there are somethings we would all agree are extremist, there are other things where it's just a rugby player quoting the Bible.
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  7. #16
    Must...have...caffeine One Bad Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terraceth View Post
    Hrm... where did the Second Ecumenical Council (a.k.a. First Council of Constantinople) condemn chiliasm? I looked at the canons of the Second Ecumenical Council and I see no condemnation of a thousand-year reign of Christ, not even in the disputed canons. It does mention Apollinarius, but only as part of a list of heretics without going into any detail as to what his heresy was. It's far more likely this was a reference to his Christological beliefs than anything else, given that from what I can tell, that was what he was most known (and criticized) for. Perhaps they also took a dim view of his chiliasm, but to use the Council as evidence of chiliasm condemnation is simply reading assumptions into the text.
    You're ignoring other possible sources of information about the Council (i.e., early church historians Socrates, Sozomen and Theodoret who subsequently covered the event) and the line from the Creed - not sure what else that could possibly have been addressing.
    Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

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  8. #17
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantaFille View Post
    To be fair, it's not made clear whether he believes the internet is already structured that way, or if he's warning that we shouldn't head towards such a configuration. Context would be helpful and none is provided.
    The video was provided. Yes, it is in Russian, but you can read the subtitles in English.

  9. #18
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    I don't know that I entirely trust the accuracy of translations of cherry-picked quotes from a source which seems hostile to the Moscow administration.
    The video was provided as well. The quotes are a fair representation of the thrust of Patriarch Kirill's views, IMO.

    I agree that smartphones can be dangerously addictive.
    They can be addictive. Taming that addiction can be a great way to exercise self-control. Patriarch Kirill is sensationalizing things, IMO.

    Given it's the first time I've heard anything like this in 11 years, I'd lean toward "no".
    Perhaps that might be partly attributed to modern Orthodox believers regarding how it will happen as "not especially important"?

    Nope. Orthodox bishops are not popes.

    In Eastern Orthodoxy, what is stressed is that we should be prepared for His return. How exactly it will happen is not especially important, though chiliasm (pre-mil) was condemned as heretical around the 4th century. The conquest of Jerusalem and destruction of the temple in AD 70 is widely held to have fulfilled eschatological prophecy, but as the general resurrection is universally held to be yet in the future, hyperpreterism is ruled out.
    So partial preterism is the dominant view in EO, but are a plurality of eschatological views present in EO?
    Last edited by Scrawly; 05-15-2019 at 12:02 AM.

  10. #19
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darfius View Post
    Look into A.I. and bitcoin as a precursor to a beast-like control grid. Throw in 5G and it's a heady mix of doom. Skynet anyone?
    To make such theories accord with the biblical description of the Antichrist and his activities will surely make your head spin!

  11. #20
    Thread Killer QuantaFille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrawly View Post
    The video was provided. Yes, it is in Russian, but you can read the subtitles in English.
    Do you trust that the video was translated accurately and was not edited? I'd rather read a transcript anyway. Maybe I'll watch the video when I get home from work.
    Curiosity never hurt anyone. It was stupidity that killed the cat.

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