Police officers nationwide flagged for racist and violent social media posts

[carpedm9587]

This could be true, but it represents a selective citation of rational reasons that you choose to justify your agenda. First in racial and ethnic crime, like the Mafia the Italians killed more Italians than anyone else. I believe in 'White crime,' such as gangs more whites are killed by whites in part simply the wars between gangs.

Second it is the destruction of Black cultural cohesion by the persecution of blacks particularly men throughout society.



I disagree with Carp as far as 'being a poverty issue.' What you are neglecting there is history of the white/Black relationships. Why are blacks in Black ghettos, and historically enslaved, racially persecuted, racially stereotyped and profilled. The judicial system is also involved in this historical injustice.

You need to realize that slavery did not end with the Civil War. It persisted long after as large scale 'penal servitude,' plantation slavery, feudal servitude on plantation well up to and into the early 20th century. These issues continued in the 20th century in many ways. After WWII Blacks were deprived of post war veterans benefits such as home loans and education GI Bill benefits. It has been only recently that Blacks have been even given the right to vote. You apparently do not realize, or simply choose to conveniently ignore history based on your agenda.

Shuny - there is no conflict here. It is the history of the black community in America that has resulted in the highly skewed poverty and education stats. The reason for focusing on the education and poverty issues is because there is noting we can do about history: it happened, and that's that. What we CAN do is look at the lasting effects and see what can be done to reverse them. This is often positioned as "white people have to feel guilty." That's a canard. I don't feel one iota of guilt over slavery or Jim Crow. I didn't do either. But I DO recognize that the legacy of these things is that, even today, I have many advantages that the average black person doesn't have. But if you get into things like "reparations," it doesn't treat people individually and it ignores the current reality. That is why I am in John Robert's camp about things like Affirmative Action. You do not solve racism by engaging in reverse racism.

But if you address the actual consequences of history, starting with poverty and education, then you lift ALL those who have most suffered. The black community will be disproportionately benefited because they are disproportionately impacted, but ALL people of poverty, white or black, are helped. ALL people who suffer with education issues, white or black, are helped. You undo the iniquities WITHOUT engaging in race-based programs.

[carpedm9587]

If I am targeted in my killing, am I good?

You should always be targeted, or you won't kill ANYONE.


But if you are selective...you'll be good!

[Cow Poke]

Shuny - there is no conflict here. It is the history of the black community in America that has resulted in the highly skewed poverty and education stats. The reason for focusing on the education and poverty issues is because there is noting we can do about history: it happened, and that's that. What we CAN do is look at the lasting effects and see what can be done to reverse them. This is often positioned as "white people have to feel guilty." That's a canard. I don't feel one iota of guilt over slavery or Jim Crow. I didn't do either. But I DO recognize that the legacy of these things is that, even today, I have many advantages that the average black person doesn't have. But if you get into things like "reparations," it doesn't treat people individually and it ignores the current reality. That is why I am in John Robert's camp about things like Affirmative Action. You do not solve racism by engaging in reverse racism.

Wow, trying hard to find something here with which to vehemently disagree.

But if you address the actual consequences of history, starting with poverty and education, then you lift ALL those who have most suffered. The black community will be disproportionately benefited because they are disproportionately impacted, but ALL people of poverty, white or black, are helped. ALL people who suffer with education issues, white or black, are helped. You undo the iniquities WITHOUT engaging in race-based programs.

Which is why I think it's tragic that we don't have more blacks who are successful being the champions for better schools, more opportunities, better role models.... The whole "Nigga" mentality we see on TV is, to me, unconscionable. I think there are too many poverty pimps aggravating the situation, and too few successful blacks calling for "stepping up".

[Cow Poke]

You should always be targeted, or you won't kill ANYONE.


But if you are selective...you'll be good!

I was actually going to change that, but figured I'd allow you one of those rare opportunities where you could correct me.

[carpedm9587]

But that's the point - There's enough going on in a "shoot / don't shoot" decision without adding politics and optics. He needs to be singularly focused on the threat assessment and his response.

Politics and optics are inevitable. If they can't take the heat...perhaps a different job? I have a great deal of respect and gratitude for law enforcement, but "respect" doesn't translate into "blind eye." When there is cause for criticism, it should be levied. And when the criticism concerns someone we have armed and empowered to uphold our laws, the scrutiny will be that much greater. With great power comes great responsibility.

It can be a deadly thing.

Yes, it can.

Why do you automatically jump to only one side of the equation? How bout some education on the other side, too, that this is a deadly situation, and requires the cooperation of BOTH individuals - the officer AND the subject.

I'm not. I seem to recall several posts about dealing with poverty and education to begin shifting the numbers on crime. I also addressed drugs and several other issues. Right now, the discussion is about police, so that is what I focused on. And, frankly, putting programs in place to root out racism in the police force is a crackable nut. Eliminating racism from the general population, that's a HUGE nut to crack. First we have to actually convince many people there IS a problem. What comes back from MANY people is "there's no such thing as systemic racism."

No argument here!

If we took all the lawyers in the world, and laid them head to toe around the equator -- THAT would be a good start!

What do you call 12 lawyers at the bottom of a well?

[carpedm9587]

Wow, trying hard to find something here with which to vehemently disagree.

Which is why I think it's tragic that we don't have more blacks who are successful being the champions for better schools, more opportunities, better role models.... The whole "Nigga" mentality we see on TV is, to me, unconscionable. I think there are too many poverty pimps aggravating the situation, and too few successful blacks calling for "stepping up".

Their voices are out there - but they don't get the attention and focus. They are predominantly working in the shadows - a bit here and there. And the ones that DO step up are pretty commonly treated like Obama. He calls for kids to "hike up their pants" and to "stop thinking like victims," and the list of ways he challenged young black people were significant. And all of those young black people he challenged got to see him ripped a new one publicly by a lot of white folks for "race baiting" and "dividing the races" and the list goes on. Almost every significant voice for the black community has seen outrage and reaction from the white community as a consequence. The history of it is long. Do we wonder that so few now step up to the plate? Obama has (AFAIK) largely gone silent. Michelle, however, has not. She is very much in that game.

[carpedm9587]

I was actually going to change that, but figured I'd allow you one of those rare opportunities where you could correct me.

Suuuuureee.. you were...

[Cow Poke]

I'm not. I seem to recall several posts about dealing with poverty and education to begin shifting the numbers on crime...

Here's what I would love to see... a bunch of black businessmen, entrepreneurs, educators.... banding together and absolutely DEMANDING school vouchers, or school choice, and challenging young blacks to prove they are equal to or superior to any white student.... a visionary... somebody to wake up the "I'm going to BE somebody" factor.... scrap this "WOKE" crap and ignite the dream!

And, yes, that's what I do in real life with our Jobs for Life program, and similar things, like SMART kids and JAM.... programs that are almost exclusively African-American, and challenge these kids to the max.

[seer]

Then make it about the family - and not the color of the skin...

Carp, I was defending the police and Shuny's claims that they were racist and that that accounted for more violent interaction between blacks and cops. When it is more likely that there are more violent encounters because blacks are more violent than the general population statistically. And that is a fact.

[carpedm9587]

Here's what I would love to see... a bunch of black businessmen, entrepreneurs, educators.... banding together and absolutely DEMANDING school vouchers, or school choice, and challenging young blacks to prove they are equal to or superior to any white student.... a visionary... somebody to wake up the "I'm going to BE somebody" factor.... scrap this "WOKE" crap and ignite the dream!

Oh, I see. If they are not getting behind school vouchers and choice (which most resist for the same reason I do - that it substantially disadvantages those left behind), then they are not "standing up and being heard?" If you want to solve the ways in which schools are widely variant, then change the way schools are funded. The current process of using property taxes, used in most states, essentially ensures that poor communities will have poor schools, and rich communities will have rich schools - furthering the already existing divide. And to solve this problem, you want to suggest that those who actually can make it work financially in those poor areas even further impoverish the poor schools, burying those who cannot escape?

That's not much of a solution.

And, yes, that's what I do in real life with our Jobs for Life program, and similar things, like SMART kids and JAM.... programs that are almost exclusively African-American, and challenge these kids to the max.

Challenging is always good. It is good to challenge a man to lift himself up by his bootstraps. But it is a cruel joke when that demand is made of a bootless man. (credit to MLK, sort of).

[carpedm9587]

Carp, I was defending the police and Shuny's claims that they were racist and that that accounted for more violent interaction between blacks and cops. When it is more likely that there are more violent encounters because blacks are more violent than the general population statistically. And that is a fact.

It is a fact - and a misleading one - because it leaves the impression that blackness = more violent. If you are comfortable continually contributing to that social problem, then I have to leave it to you. My request stands, if you ever see fit to honor it. Constantly associating blackness with violence perpetuates the stereotype that "black people are violent." I hope, someday, you see fit to express yourself differently.

[seer]

It is a fact - and a misleading one - because it leaves the impression that blackness = more violent. If you are comfortable continually contributing to that social problem, then I have to leave it to you. My request stands, if you ever see fit to honor it. Constantly associating blackness with violence perpetuates the stereotype that "black people are violent." I hope, someday, you see fit to express yourself differently.

And constantly accusing police of racism is OK with you? And I'm not contributing to the social problem, I'm not making blacks kill blacks at horrible levels...

[Mountain Man]

It is a fact - and a misleading one - because it leaves the impression that blackness = more violent.

If that's the conclusion you wish to reach then that's on you. I don't know why blacks in America are disproportionately more likely to commit violent crimes. All I know is that they are. So perhaps the solution for police "racism" needs to start in black communities and not police departments.

I think the first step should be severing ties from the Democrat party who has spent decades basically telling them that they're not smart enough or hardworking enough to succeed on their own without a handout from their Democrat masters.

[carpedm9587]

And constantly accusing police of racism is OK with you?

Pointing out that we should have a zero tolerance for racism in our police force is quite fine with me, and jumping on ANY police officer who engages in racist activity/language and either removing them from the force or curtailing their role to non-enforcement activities is also fine with me. Labeling ALL police racist because of the actions of a few is NOT fine with me. But ignoring obviously racist actions and words is also NOT fine with me.

And I'm not contributing to the social problem, I'm not making blacks kill blacks at horrible levels...

You can ignore it all you wish Seer. I have come to find you are pretty good at ignoring a reality that is right in front of you when you want to. It does not change the fact that constantly reinforcing the theme "violence is linked to blackness" actually DOES do social harm; it perpetuates a stereotype that harms every single black person NOT so engaged.

[carpedm9587]

If that's the conclusion you wish to reach then that's on you. I don't know why blacks in America are disproportionately more likely to commit violent crimes. All I know is that they are.

As noted - a true fact. However, as I said to Seer, continually affirming that violence is linked to blackness only affirms a stereotype that harms every black person NOT so engaged.

So perhaps the solution for police "racism" needs to start in black communities and not police departments.

Perhaps this is a false dichotomy...

I think the first step should be severing ties from the Democrat party who has spent decades basically telling them that they're not smart enough or hardworking enough to succeed on their own without a handout from their Democrat masters.

Yeah... I've heard this meme before. Sorry. Not buying it. While I agree that too many programs foster a sense of entitlement instead of self-sufficiency, and I would re-engineer MOST of the existing programs, I see honest mistakes being made here. It is not different than the charity that goes in after a disaster and deals with the short-term need as THEY see it without maximizing the sustainability of their efforts. Then they leave and it all falls apart, often leaving the indigenous people worse of then before. The intent is good - but the execution is poor. THAT the Democrats are guilty of in spades. Treating minorities as "slaves," no. That's just the latest political meme from the right, where the problems with racism are chronic in many places.