Police officers nationwide flagged for racist and violent social media posts

[shunyadragon]

It is relevant Shuny,

Not irrelevant at all. The evidence clearly demonstrates this.

if the violence in the black community explains the higher rates of violence between blacks and cops as opposed to the cops being inherently racist.

Again, again and again I did not claim cops are inherently racist. The evidence concerns the greater violence against blacks, and racism is problem in law enforcement.

Yes it is abundantly clear that your line of reasoning concludes that the violence among blacks is caused by your assertion that blacks are more violent..

[Mountain Man]

So Brietbart cherry picks one black person that agrees with you and this is proof you are right?

Right, if it contradicts your position, it's a "meme" or "cherry picking".

I have responded to this, so I'll let me previous responses stand.

Believe it or not, I don't hang on your every word. Which previous post are you referring to?

[Adrift]

By now y'all should realize that whenever carpe is confronted by anything that does not match his narrative he tends to hand wave it off as being nothing but a right wing meme.

To be fair, I think most Democrats are sincerely concerned with the plight of ethnic minority groups. Sure there are probably some who stir the waters only to shore up support for whatever policies they want to enact, or to keep themselves in the spotlight. That's just politics as usual, and Republicans do the same on their side, but the Democrat on the street I think really actually does sincerely want to help in some way. And there are even a few politicians who I think sincerely feel that way as well.

[JonathanL]

As I said, Chrawnus, I am under no illusion that Seer is racist or intending to link violence to race. I think his words inevitably do. I am suggesting people consider what impact constantly hearing, "black people are more violent" has in our society, and recommending a change in language to reflect what is actually intended, and perhaps shift attention from "black people" to "poverty" and "education" in the process.

People's interpretation of his words, ripped from their context, might lead someone to believe that Seer is linking violence to race. But read in their proper context you would need have a serious reading comprehension deficit in order to come to that conclusion. Which means it's not in Seer's words that theme of "violence is linked to blackness" is reinforced, but in a person's uncharitable reading of his words.

And in the context of his discussion with Shuny it doesn't make any sense to shift the attention to poverty and education, except maybe as a small sidetrack, because that's not the issue of the discussion between Seer and Shuny. The reason why there is a higher incidence of violence in the black community compared to the white community in the US is an interesting question, but in the context of this discussion the more important issue is whether there is indeed a higher incidence of violence in the black community in comparison with other communities, regardless of the reason.

[JonathanL]

Yes it is abundantly clear that your line of reasoning concludes that the violence among blacks is caused by your assertion that blacks are more violent..

This is the kind of uncharitable reading of seer's words that I'm talking about. It's clear as day from the context that seer is not claiming that blacks are inherently more violent, but only that there is a higher rate of violence in the black community, but shuny still insists on reading his words in a manner that makes it seem seer is propagating racist ideas. Whether shuny is doing this because he has malicious intentions or because his reading comprehension is lacking I don't know, but experience leads me to believe it's probably the latter.

[carpedm9587]

Right, if it contradicts your position, it's a "meme" or "cherry picking".

No. If a debater cites a single, specifically selected person (hence "cherry picking") and offers it as some form of proof for an oft-repeated (hence "meme") inn accuracy, then they have no done much to make their case.

Believe it or not, I don't hang on your every word. Which previous post are you referring to?

Many of them, but you can start with 165, 161, 151, and 146.

[carpedm9587]

Rogue, in case you missed post #146, I'd love to have a chance to examine those studies, if you have links.

[carpedm9587]

People's interpretation of his words, ripped from their context, might lead someone to believe that Seer is linking violence to race. But read in their proper context you would need have a serious reading comprehension deficit in order to come to that conclusion. Which means it's not in Seer's words that theme of "violence is linked to blackness" is reinforced, but in a person's uncharitable reading of his words.

And in the context of his discussion with Shuny it doesn't make any sense to shift the attention to poverty and education, except maybe as a small sidetrack, because that's not the issue of the discussion between Seer and Shuny. The reason why there is a higher incidence of violence in the black community compared to the white community in the US is an interesting question, but in the context of this discussion the more important issue is whether there is indeed a higher incidence of violence in the black community in comparison with other communities, regardless of the reason.

Again, it is not about "Seer" or any other specific individual; it is about the harm done by phrasing things in a way that continually links "violence" to "being black." The statement "black people are more violent than whites" is simply untrue, and the phrasing is misleading and contributes to a pervasive social problem. Is it REALLY that much of an issue to simply adjust language to better reflect reality and not contribute to this stereotype?

IMO, this type of exchange is what leads to many to point to conservatives and Republicans and scream "racist." Even the simplest of requests to consider the impact of words (never mind actions) is fought to the last man. I don't defend people making that accusation on such a sweeping scale, but I am beginning to understand it.

[carpedm9587]

To be fair, I think most Democrats are sincerely concerned with the plight of ethnic minority groups. Sure there are probably some who stir the waters only to shore up support for whatever policies they want to enact, or to keep themselves in the spotlight. That's just politics as usual, and Republicans do the same on their side, but the Democrat on the street I think really actually does sincerely want to help in some way. And there are even a few politicians who I think sincerely feel that way as well.

Exactly. Their methodology often sucks - no doubt about it. But the intent is generally "for the good."

[lilpixieofterror]

Exactly. Their methodology often sucks - no doubt about it. But the intent is generally "for the good."

The road to hell is paved with ‘good intentions’.

[carpedm9587]

The road to hell is paved with ‘good intentions’.

Well....you know what I think about "hell"

[rogue06]

The road to hell is paved with ‘good intentions’.

The greatest tragic villains are those who didn't mean to do so much evil.

[lilpixieofterror]

Well....you know what I think about "hell"

Which doesn’t change the fact that much misery and destruction has been wrought on people with ‘good intentions.’

[carpedm9587]

Which doesn’t change the fact that much misery and destruction has been wrought on people with ‘good intentions.’

I agree it would be nice to have programs that are better thought-through. Unfortunately, by the time a good idea gets through the political and lobbying machine, the result is often less than ideal. Still, as they say, "representative democracy is the worst governing system in the world - except for all the rest."

And I frankly don't see a lot of difference between programs that come from the right or left. They all seem to end up "less than ideal."

[lilpixieofterror]

The greatest tragic villains are those who didn't mean to do so much evil.

Few people are psychopaths and tend to seek justifications their actions as ‘being for the greater good’ or something to that effect.