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Reproductive Rights --- Protect - Defend - Extend

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Tassman View Post
    Certainly, in those instances. So, why aren't you anti-abortionists allowing legal abortions in the case of rape? In Alabama — lawmakers have even banned abortion for rape victims AND rapists’ parental rights are protected.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...=.85b1ad37908e

    But abortion is also acceptable before fetal viability if the woman so chooses. This is when the vast majority of abortions occur. So, no problem.
    We actually do allow abortion if not having one would kill the mother. That would prevent two deaths. But in the case of rape, it isn't the child's fault. If you dad robbed a bank, should we toss you in jail for it?

    But my point was you pro abortionists like to use "rape" as an excuse for "needing" abortions, when rape is less than 1/2 of 1% of all abortions. .05% - And the overwhelming reason for abortions is convenience.

    abortion stats.jpg
    https://abort73.com/abortion_facts/us_abortion_statistics/

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      We actually do allow abortion if not having one would kill the mother. That would prevent two deaths. But in the case of rape, it isn't the child's fault. If you dad robbed a bank, should we toss you in jail for it?
      In our society, when there has been a rape, it is strongly advised that the female be subject to a "rape kit" at the hospital or clinic following the assault. Besides the obvious medical care for the victim, there is also evidence collection and forensic exam, and even counseling followup advice.

      I'm totally ignorant on this aspect, so I'm just asking -- has there been discussion about pregnancy intervention at that point? Has there been any study as to the acceptability of that type of intervention?
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        In our society, when there has been a rape, it is strongly advised that the female be subject to a "rape kit" at the hospital or clinic following the assault. Besides the obvious medical care for the victim, there is also evidence collection and forensic exam, and even counseling followup advice.

        I'm totally ignorant on this aspect, so I'm just asking -- has there been discussion about pregnancy intervention at that point? Has there been any study as to the acceptability of that type of intervention?
        You mean like the "morning after pill?"

        I don't know, but I suspect they might offer that. It would still be abortion in my opinion.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Sparko View Post
          You mean like the "morning after pill?"

          I don't know, but I suspect they might offer that. It would still be abortion in my opinion.
          And I'm certainly not advocating it - I'm just wondering if any of the pro-life side has.... In all my dealings with our local pregnancy center, I don't think that's ever come up. I think I'll ask.
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Sparko View Post
            You didn't answer my question.

            If abortion is only needed in the case of rape or health why aren't you abortionists only asking for legal abortions in the case of rape? Or in the case where the mother's health was in danger?

            Contraceptives are 99% effective if used as directed.

            so if those were the only times an abortion was needed, there would only be a handful of abortions per year. Not millions.

            Hmm?
            Many of those who advocate for abortion to be legal do ask for it to be legal only under limited circumstances - usually some combination of rape, foetal viability, health risks, early term, incest.

            Many of those who advocate for abortion to be illegal have similar lists of exceptions.

            Those who characterise the opposite point of view as being that abortions should always or never be allowed are arguing against the extremes, not the majority. Possibly because such arguments are much easier than thinking. Those same people often ignore their own exceptions too. Since their arguments will never convince the extremists and don't even apply to the non-extremists,* all they are doing is fuelling the ire and driving the gap wider. Nothing will ever be achieved by that.

            When people stop railing against phantoms and take the time to actually examine the views of those they oppose, the differences usually come down to questions like:
            - is incest a legitimate exception?
            - what qualifies as foetal viability?
            - what do you do about the 1-3% of cases where contraceptives weren't effective?
            - is the mental health of the mother relevant?
            Discussions arising from questions like those can actually change peoples views. Mischaracterisation can't.



            *some-one recently posted testimony about the procedure for aborting a 22-week-old foetus in response to some-one talking about the first trimester.
            Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

            MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
            MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

            seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Roy View Post
              Many of those who advocate for abortion to be legal do ask for it to be legal only under limited circumstances - usually some combination of rape, foetal viability, health risks, early term, incest.
              And there's the rub, because liberals tend to broadly define "health risks" to include the mother's emotional and mental health, which in many cases amounts to nothing more than the typical distress a woman might feel if she didn't intend to become pregnant.
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Roy View Post
                Many of those who advocate for abortion to be legal do ask for it to be legal only under limited circumstances - usually some combination of rape, foetal viability, health risks, early term, incest.
                Yeah, at least here in the states most want to see abortion further restricted than it is now, although for some odd reason the MSM always buries or completely spikes that. Meanwhile, on the left, they are racing to remove every conceivable limitation including legalizing abortion right up to the moment of birth (and then wildly celebrating it where they've succeeded) -- and even in some cases after the mother has given birth.

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Yeah, at least here in the states most want to see abortion further restricted than it is now, although for some odd reason the MSM always buries or completely spikes that. Meanwhile, on the left, they are racing to remove every conceivable limitation including legalizing abortion right up to the moment of birth (and then wildly celebrating it where they've succeeded) -- and even in some cases after the mother has given birth.
                  Hence, the "culture of death".
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Those who characterise the opposite point of view as being that abortions should always or never be allowed are arguing against the extremes, not the majority. Possibly because such arguments are much easier than thinking.
                    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                    And there's the rub, because liberals tend to broadly define "health risks" to include the mother's emotional and mental health, which in many cases amounts to nothing more than the typical distress a woman might feel if she didn't intend to become pregnant.
                    I don't think for a moment that that is true. It certainly isn't true of the liberals who post here.

                    But it is an excellent example of the characterisation to extremes I referred to.
                    Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                    MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                    MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                    seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                    Comment

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