Changing the Lord's Prayer

[Terraceth]

First off, though, an error on my part: I incorrectly ascribed this to a textual variation. There is a textual variation in this passage, but the translation question here occurs within one one of the variations. The variant is "...on Earth peace, good will to men" compared to "...on Earth peace to men of good will." The actual question here is, if we are using the latter textual variant, whether it should be translated as "men (or people) of good will" or as "men (or people) beloved by God".

However, in your discussion here regarding translations, you don't seem to actually offer an explanation as to why the "new" translation is actually wrong. A bit of research indicates that the literal translation is "men/people of good will", which is what it was translated as for a while. However, it seems that most translations switched to the modern "men/people beloved by God" due to the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls indicating that was the more accurate meaning of the phrase.

I'm far from an expert on Greek/Hebrew but it seems extremely defensible as better expressing the meaning of the original phrase. I read that Benedict XVI actually advocated the new wording in his book on the infancy narratives, but I don't have a copy to verify.

[lee_merrill]

There is a textual variation in this passage, but the translation question here occurs within one one of the variations. The variant is "...on Earth peace, good will to men" compared to "...on Earth peace to men of good will." The actual question here is, if we are using the latter textual variant, whether it should be translated as "men (or people) of good will" or as "men (or people) beloved by God".

But I'm not sure how this applies to the translation of the Lord's prayer, there is no textual variant in Mt. 6:13.

Blessings,
Lee

[Terraceth]

But I'm not sure how this applies to the translation of the Lord's prayer, there is no textual variant in Mt. 6:13.

We weren't talking about the Lord's Prayer; we were talking about the Gloria (Luke 2:14).

Also, you're incorrect; there is a textual variant in Matthew 6:13, which is whether "For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen" occurs at the end of it or not. This variation is noted in the various translations such as the NIV, NASB, and NRSV.

[lee_merrill]

Also, you're incorrect; there is a textual variant in Matthew 6:13, which is whether "For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen" occurs at the end of it or not. This variation is noted in the various translations such as the NIV, NASB, and NRSV.

But that's a different verse, there is no variant in Matthew 6 verse 13...

Blessings,
Lee

[Terraceth]

But that's a different verse, there is no variant in Matthew 6 verse 13...

Blessings,
Lee

No, not a separate verse; it's a variant within Matthew 6:13. Of the Bibles that either include it or mention it in a footnote, it (or its footnote) is placed within Matthew 6:13. Observe:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...3&version=NASB
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...13&version=KJV
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...13&version=NIV
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...3&version=NRSV
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...13&version=ESV

I know that the start/end of verses was decided somewhat arbitrarily by those who originally set the numbering centuries ago, but the fact remains that under the standard verse numbering, the variant occurs in Matthew 6:13.

[lee_merrill]

Alrighty, my mistake, I was assuming "yours is the kingdom..." was a different verse...