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Thread: And can you still support him?

  1. #241
    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    I don't know whether it matters, but in context, the "works" in 1 Cor. 3 seem to be those things which strengthen and unify the Church, as opposed to the jealousy, strife, and hero-worship at the beginning of the chapter.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

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    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

  2. #242
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    John 6 seems (to me) to be fairly clear in teaching that the only "work" needed to obtain "eternal life" is to "believe" in Jesus. IOW, in John's terminology, "pisteuo" itself is sufficient.
    I don't think - in context - one can ever separate Jesus talking about belief from that belief producing real change. Jesus, much more so than paul in the Gospels, always points to what people do and think as evidence what who they really are, what they really believe. That is why he is so hard on the Pharisees, their words and their lives were so completely out of sync that their claims of belief amounted to nothing.

    Jim
    OK - maybe there are 'some' friends

  3. Amen JimL amen'd this post.
  4. #243
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    I don't know whether it matters, but in context, the "works" in 1 Cor. 3 seem to be those things which strengthen and unify the Church, as opposed to the jealousy, strife, and hero-worship at the beginning of the chapter.
    I think the context is larger than just the Church since Paul goes on to talk about personal conduct.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  5. #244
    tWebber tabibito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    I don't know whether it matters, but in context, the "works" in 1 Cor. 3 seem to be those things which strengthen and unify the Church, as opposed to the jealousy, strife, and hero-worship at the beginning of the chapter.
    Quite correct - Paul points to works of the law on the one hand, and works of love, faith etc on the other. Paul also makes a big deal of the things we ought to do - which might seem to indicate that those things are optional. However, the word translated as "ought" is οφειλ(ε)ω - showing that an obligation exists, and thus those things are mandatory. There is no "natural outcome of faith" action in Paul's writing - there is mandatory action.
    Last edited by tabibito; 06-26-2019 at 12:59 AM.
    1 Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω

  6. #245
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Only you would suggest that plain English is not an understandable language.
    Yeah, that's why you all are always arguing about what this passage or that passage is actually trying to say.

  7. #246
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimLamebrain View Post
    Yeah, that's why you all are always arguing about what this passage or that passage is actually trying to say.
    Now if only you could demonstrate that "understandable language" and using that language to convey complex and nuanced ideas worthy of discussion and debate are mutually exclusive.

    Of course given your poor grasp of English, it's not surprising you wouldn't consider it an understandable language.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  8. #247
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Yeah, that's why you all are always arguing about what this passage or that passage is actually trying to say.
    Well that and the fact not one word in the Bible is actually written in English. There is that little bugaboo.

    These are writings from an ancient culture in an ancient language with ancient idioms and cultural references that a translated into modern english by scholars doing their very best to preserve the original meaning. But these are concepts that were difficult in their day in their original language and culture. Even the Bible itself speaks about how Paul's writings are not necessarily easy to understand and that they are easily distorted by unstable or unknowledgeable people. Paul was a rabbi of the highest order, and his mind did not think on these things idly or simply, and people today reading his words are foolish to think they are necessarily easy to comprehend in their fullness.


    Jim
    OK - maybe there are 'some' friends

  9. Amen MaxVel amen'd this post.
  10. #248
    tWebber Leonhard's Avatar
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    Its only a pro-life stance that could make me consider and struggle with whether or not to vote for Trump.

  11. #249
    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Its only a pro-life stance that could make me consider and struggle with whether or not to vote for Trump.
    It was a struggle and literally last-second decision for me in 2016. It will be easy-peasy to vote for him in 2020.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

    Beige Nationalist.

    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

  12. #250
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Its only a pro-life stance that could make me consider and struggle with whether or not to vote for Trump.
    I dont think I could ever actually vote for Trump. Though if the democrat is bad enough I may have no choice as I really, really believe to not vote is to relinquish control to the worst of the worst.

    Jim

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