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Thread: Kids In Cages...

  1. #121
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    Yeah...not so much. Look - an expert is more likely to have a correct opinion, by virtue of the fact that they are an expert. I grant you that. But that doesn't mean any of us should simply blindly accept what an expert says because they are an expert. Rogue's and Seer's response boiled down to "who are you to question an expert?" Who I am is a rational, thinking human being who can do some research, evaluate arguments, and weigh them on their merits. I've put forward my reasons for my immigration positions and the wall. If someone wants to tackle the issues raised, I'm happy to discuss. If they just want to declare that "experts disagree with me," then they haven't made an argument; they've just observed a situation. I already know I disagree with a few experts. That doesn't advance the discussion, IMO.

    And I am way past repeating myself, so I'll leave the last word on "experts" to y'all. If anyone wants to discuss the actual issues, I'm happy to engage.
    Very good explanation. The fact that you needed to explain it is - however - not so good
    "This is why in my debates with atheists and agnostics I always try to treat them with charity and civility and not engage in name-calling or insults or even just interruptions. I think that is uncivil discourse." - Dr. William Lane Craig.

  2. #122
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    If the wall was the most effective bang for the buck, then it could perhaps be justified ... if.

    What evidence is there that is the best long term use of the billions required to create and maintain it?

    Jim
    because the alternative is larger and larger caravans coming to the US and overwhelming the camps and causing a humanitarian aid problem with the overcrowded conditions.

  3. #123
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpedm9587 View Post
    Yeah...not so much. Look - an expert is more likely to have a correct opinion, by virtue of the fact that they are an expert. I grant you that. But that doesn't mean any of us should simply blindly accept what an expert says because they are an expert. Rogue's and Seer's response boiled down to "who are you to question an expert?" Who I am is a rational, thinking human being who can do some research, evaluate arguments, and weigh them on their merits. I've put forward my reasons for my immigration positions and the wall. If someone wants to tackle the issues raised, I'm happy to discuss. If they just want to declare that "experts disagree with me," then they haven't made an argument; they've just observed a situation. I already know I disagree with a few experts. That doesn't advance the discussion, IMO.

    And I am way past repeating myself, so I'll leave the last word on "experts" to y'all. If anyone wants to discuss the actual issues, I'm happy to engage.
    So basically we should just ignore your personal opinion because you have absolutely no expertise or knowledge of the situation, or of walls and are just an arm-chair pontificator spouting off nonsense? OK!

  4. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  5. #124
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    So basically we should just ignore your personal opinion because you have absolutely no expertise or knowledge of the situation, or of walls and are just an arm-chair pontificator spouting off nonsense? OK!
    Sounds more like a personal attack than an argument.
    "This is why in my debates with atheists and agnostics I always try to treat them with charity and civility and not engage in name-calling or insults or even just interruptions. I think that is uncivil discourse." - Dr. William Lane Craig.

  6. #125
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    Sounds more like a personal attack than an argument.
    It was merely a question.

    This is a personal attack:
    Chuck, you are a troll and a moron who nobody takes seriously. If we had a way to do it, I would dub you the Official Peanut Gallery of Theologyweb. Feel free to add that to your profile if you want.

  7. #126
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    It was merely a question.

    This is a personal attack:
    Chuck, you are a troll and a moron who nobody takes seriously. If we had a way to do it, I would dub you the Official Peanut Gallery of Theologyweb. Feel free to add that to your profile if you want.
    Not only a question. And the part that was a question implied stuff about the person that did not go along the lines of the post it was a reply to. He actually wrote: "Who I am is a rational, thinking human being who can do some research, evaluate arguments, and weigh them on their merits. I've put forward my reasons for my immigration positions and the wall. If someone wants to tackle the issues raised, I'm happy to discuss. If they just want to declare that "experts disagree with me," then they haven't made an argument; they've just observed a situation. I already know I disagree with a few experts. That doesn't advance the discussion, IMO."

    No need for your question based on that. And it is quite easy to see that you try to signal something completely different from what he wrote.
    "This is why in my debates with atheists and agnostics I always try to treat them with charity and civility and not engage in name-calling or insults or even just interruptions. I think that is uncivil discourse." - Dr. William Lane Craig.

  8. #127
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    The observation that "an eleven-foot ladder defeats a ten-foot wall" has been well-worn. No one claims that a wall alone will solve the problem. The claim is that a wall will *impede* the invaders, and be one tool among many to help the beleaguered border personnel.
    An 11-foot ladder might defeat a 10-foot wall, but a 10-foot wall beats no wall!
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  9. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  10. #128
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    BUUUURP
    Yeah I thought that is what you said. Excuse you.

  11. #129
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    An 11-foot ladder might defeat a 10-foot wall, but a 10-foot wall beats no wall!
    Yup. Walls and fences have been used successfully for thousands of years. But now, all of a sudden, in just this one case, they would be completely useless?

    They act as if we would just put up a fence and then ignore it. They would be patrolled, probably have sensors, etc. It's a lot easier for an ICE outpost to patrol 30 miles of fence than 30 miles of open desert.

  12. Amen Teallaura, Mountain Man amen'd this post.
  13. #130
    tWebber Teallaura's Avatar
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    Whether or not an eleven foot ladder beats a ten foot fence depends on how you plan to get down the other side. With a twenty foot wall you're courting a world of pain if you jump...

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