View Poll Results: Are you tired of Political Correctness?

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23. You may not vote on this poll
  • Don't care one way or the other

    2 8.70%
  • I'm really tired of Political Correctness

    19 82.61%
  • Political Correctness is a good thing!

    2 8.70%
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Thread: Americans Strongly Dislike PC Culture

  1. #11
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I'm certainly not for total freedom of speech. But I think we can get downright nutty with the limitations, and I think that's what this topic is all about.
    I'm in favor of total freedom. Yes, you absolutely should have the right to yell, "Fire!" in a crowded theater, but you should also be punished if it results in a panicked stampede. In that case, the crime is creating a panic and not "abusing" free speech. In other words, punish the result and not the means.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  2. Amen seanD, NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  3. #12
    tWebber TheWall's Avatar
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    The way I see it freedom of speach implies that you have the freedom and knowledge to understand what you are saying.

  4. #13
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    I'm in favor of total freedom. Yes, you absolutely should have the right to yell, "Fire!" in a crowded theater, but you should also be punished if it results in a panicked stampede. In that case, the crime is creating a panic and not "abusing" free speech. In other words, punish the result and not the means.
    Problem is, if there's a stampede, plenty of other people are going to bear the consequences besides yourself.
    "Technology has, in an enhanced way, given mockers a platform to set society on fire with polarizing speech. Internet culture privileges those whose insults are click bait." - Timothy Keller

  5. #14
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Problem is, if there's a stampede, plenty of other people are going to bear the consequences besides yourself.
    Yep. And a lot of money wasted trying to create and litigate an ad hoc charge to cover the wrong done.

    Jim

  6. #15
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    I'm in favor of total freedom. Yes, you absolutely should have the right to yell, "Fire!" in a crowded theater, but you should also be punished if it results in a panicked stampede. In that case, the crime is creating a panic and not "abusing" free speech. In other words, punish the result and not the means.
    The reason that exception is the classic one is that the result is pretty reliably predictable. There is no legitimate reason to yell FIRE in a crowded theater, unless there's a fire.
    Every problem is the result of a previous solution.

  7. #16
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Problem is, if there's a stampede, plenty of other people are going to bear the consequences besides yourself.
    Yes, so in that case, you prohibit actions intended to cause a panic, you don't specifically target a fundamental right.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  8. #17
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Could not answer the poll as worded. PC is a recent loaded political agenda issue, and used as a word club.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  9. #18
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    Could not answer the poll as worded. PC is a recent loaded political agenda issue, and used as a word club.
    Cool.
    Every problem is the result of a previous solution.

  10. #19
    tWebber Adrift's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Political Correctness is a loaded term. It basically means "speech regulation that I don't like".

    There's "Political Correctness" on this forum, there are certain words that can't be said, discussions that can't be had, images that can't be linked to etc. If you want a free speech forum go to 4chan, there you'll find pedophilia cartoons, industrial accidents gloried in, hyper explicit racism, and so forth. Anything less than that could in some fashion be considered "Politically Correct"

    So while I get that Conservatives have gripes about some toxic Leftists deeming some things microaggressions, or threatening people for not using a preferred pronoun, we shouldn't forget that there was a time when the Moral Majority wanted to regulate all manner of things and whether they could be shown in television.
    I don't agree with this. Communities, religious institutions, work places, and the like have all had rules on what was considered acceptable or unacceptable speech for various reasons. I don't believe that political correctness was/is the same thing. Political correctness seemed to be the ideology that society at-large ought to talk and behave a certain way, that took into consideration the under-privileged, disadvantaged, and powerless. And initially, I think most people found this to be a good thing, and perhaps healthy for society. But political correctness was really championed by progressive secularists that leaned increasingly post-modern, and they couldn't really ground their "ought" in anything substantial, and because of this, what ended up happening is that this good thing was pushed into the realm of absurdity where people started to look for offence where no offence was ever intended. And that's why people don't like Political Correctness.

    On the topic of 4Chan; That website is populated with both children, and man-children. They're not really a reflection of society with free-speech taken to it's extreme, than they are the grubby, Doritos-eating, Mountain Dew-chuggin, anime/video game-obsessed, unwashed masses living in their mom's basement. They represent Peter Pan syndrome taken to it's extreme under the veil of total and utter anonymity. And even that website has censorship (it's not very broad, but it's there). If larger society had even an inkling how degenerate and childishly stupid that website was, they'd be horrified. So, no, it's not really an accurate representation of "free speech" in society.

  11. #20
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrift View Post
    I don't agree with this. Communities, religious institutions, work places, and the like have all had rules on what was considered acceptable or unacceptable speech for various reasons. I don't believe that political correctness was/is the same thing. Political correctness seemed to be the ideology that society at-large ought to talk and behave a certain way, that took into consideration the under-privileged, disadvantaged, and powerless. And initially, I think most people found this to be a good thing, and perhaps healthy for society. But political correctness was really championed by progressive secularists that leaned increasingly post-modern, and they couldn't really ground their "ought" in anything substantial, and because of this, what ended up happening is that this good thing was pushed into the realm of absurdity where people started to look for offence where no offence was ever intended. And that's why people don't like Political Correctness.
    Yes, and the "acceptableness" of language or terminology or certain topics has long been governed by varying social norms. We use phrases like, "Well, I can't really discuss this in polite company", which is a recognition that there are accepted limitations one should not violate.

    Many years ago, I worked at a truck terminal where tractors and trailers were matched up for their journeys, and there was a large cafeteria where these truckers would eat or relax, waiting for their loads from dispatch. My job was to move tractors around the yard, but union rules required others to do the actual combining of tractors and trailers.

    One of my favorite things to do was to come into the cafeteria on my break, and truckers would have they Playboy and Penthouse magazines, and be telling their "colorful" stories and using foul language, but I would plop open my King James Bible onto the table, and open my lunch kit and just sit there. The "slickback" magazines would disappear, the language would clean up a bit..... truckers would be talking about their wives instead of their girlfriends....

    I really doubt that would work in this day and age. I'd probably be cussed out and run off.

    So, yeah, 'political correctness' may have begun with this recognition that we really need to be civil when we talk about the under-privileged or minorities or whatever --- but it has gotten WAY out of hand.

    I think that's actually something that helped elect Trump - that political correctness had gotten so out of hand, and he was slapping it down. Granted, he could well have gone too far - but at the time he was campaigning, it was getting really crazy.

    It really hit home to me when I saw comedians mock PC by attempting to tell a joke.... "There was this fat guy... no, sorry, can't say fat guy... there was this MIDGET... nope, can't... ok, so there was a black ... um... person of color... African-American..... no, um..... a JEW.... "

    It has just gotten absolutely insane.
    Every problem is the result of a previous solution.

  12. Amen Adrift, Cerebrum123 amen'd this post.

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