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How to trace a gun in the US

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  • How to trace a gun in the US

    A very interesting article here about how the US authorities manage to trace weapon owners without being allowed to use any computer assistance.

    Also contains lots of information about how many guns are manufactured, imported and sold in the US - more than 15 million per year.
    Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

    MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
    MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

    seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

  • #2
    That is pretty interesting but it doesn't seem as hard as that article makes it sound.

    1. Get the serial number.
    2. Call the manufacturer and ask which Federally licensed dealer they sold it to.
    3. Call the dealer and ask who they sold it to.

    Sure, after that it could be a problem if the owner sold the gun to someone else or moved. But even with a computerized central database you would have that problem.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      That is pretty interesting but it doesn't seem as hard as that article makes it sound.

      1. Get the serial number.
      2. Call the manufacturer and ask which Federally licensed dealer they sold it to.
      3. Call the dealer and ask who they sold it to.

      Sure, after that it could be a problem if the owner sold the gun to someone else or moved. But even with a computerized central database you would have that problem.
      The problem is that there are apparently an awful lot of dealers (more gun dealers than supermarkets!!!) and they often don't stay around.
      Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

      MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
      MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

      seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Roy View Post
        ...more gun dealers than supermarkets....
        America the beautiful!
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Roy View Post
          The problem is that there are apparently an awful lot of dealers (more gun dealers than supermarkets!!!) and they often don't stay around.
          I am sure they still have to keep their records just for such purposes. Plus it seems they send copies to that warehouse in the story. I am assuming that is what all those "boxes" are. And even though they can't use computers for the records, I am pretty sure they use a computer inventory system to track which boxes are from who and which years. Plus they said in the story they are supposedly going to PDF files, just not searchable ones. But then if they keep a database of each firearm dealer and year and month, with the information form the manufacturer that tells them when it was shipped to the dealer, they can quickly look it up.

          I think that story was trying to make it sound harder than it is for dramatic effect. I work at a law firm that deals with paper discovery in much the same way. We will digitize it to pdf, then put it in a database that will sort it by vendor, date, subject, etc. Of course we also make the documents searchable which makes it easier to find what we are looking for, but then we are looking for specific data and phrases and keywords that deal with a legal case.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Roy View Post
            The problem is that there are apparently an awful lot of dealers (more gun dealers than supermarkets!!!) and they often don't stay around.
            Several are multi-purpose stores, like Dick's Sporting Goods and Walmart.
            That's what
            - She

            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
            - Stephen R. Donaldson

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
              Several are multi-purpose stores, like Dick's Sporting Goods and Walmart.
              Didn't Dick's recently quit selling firearms? I know they had announced this intent several times in recent years (without carrying through with it) but I think they finally did so shortly after Parkland.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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              • #8
                Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                Didn't Dick's recently quit selling firearms? I know they had announced this intent several times in recent years (without carrying through with it) but I think they finally did so shortly after Parkland.
                Most did. I think the one near me still does though.

                https://www.dickssportinggoods.com/f/rifles
                That's what
                - She

                Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                - Stephen R. Donaldson

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Didn't Dick's recently quit selling firearms? I know they had announced this intent several times in recent years (without carrying through with it) but I think they finally did so shortly after Parkland.
                  Dick's may have stopped selling firearms, but Field & Stream, which is owned by Dick's, didn't. At my local shopping center, Dick's and Field & Stream are right next to each other, and you can walk from one directly into the other.
                  Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                  But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                  Than a fool in the eyes of God


                  From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                    I am sure they still have to keep their records just for such purposes. Plus it seems they send copies to that warehouse in the story. I am assuming that is what all those "boxes" are. And even though they can't use computers for the records, I am pretty sure they use a computer inventory system to track which boxes are from who and which years.
                    No, they don't. Not allowed.
                    Plus they said in the story they are supposedly going to PDF files, just not searchable ones. But then if they keep a database of each firearm dealer and year and month,...
                    I don't think that's allowed either.
                    I think that story was trying to make it sound harder than it is for dramatic effect. I work at a law firm that deals with paper discovery in much the same way. We will digitize it to pdf, then put it in a database that will sort it by vendor, date, subject, etc.
                    Definitely not allowed.

                    The article made it very clear that the law allows them no computer storage or search capability whatsoever.
                    Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                    MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                    MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                    seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Roy View Post
                      No, they don't. Not allowed. I don't think that's allowed either.Definitely not allowed.

                      The article made it very clear that the law allows them no computer storage or search capability whatsoever.
                      No it said the documents can't be searchable. Not the filing system. The PDFs have to be imaged and not searchable. But the filing system the PDF are stored under will be. You use a database or even file folders with the documents sorted by Firearm's dealer, location, and date.

                      They can use pictures of paper, like microfilm (they recently got the go-ahead to convert the microfilm to PDFs), as long as the pictures of paper are not searchable.


                      Just set up a filing system like this:

                      Walmart/Los Angeles/2019/August/
                      And inside that folder keep all of the pdfs for that month.

                      Same with boxes. Just keep the boxes sorted by firearms dealer, location, date. Then walk down the aisle and find the correct box and dig through it.

                      Comment

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