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A Good Guy With A Gun...

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  • A Good Guy With A Gun...

    Thankfully no one was hurt...

    Former firefighter stops man armed with 100 rounds of ammunition at south Springfield Walmart

    SPRINGFIELD, Mo. The Springfield Police Department says it responded to a call of an active shooter at the Walmart Neighborhood Market at Republic Rd., near Golden Ave., Thursday evening.

    The Springfield Police Department arrived on scene within three minutes of the call. Police stated that a young white male, appearing to be in his twenties, pulled up to the Walmart, where he donned body armor and military fatigues. Police say the man had tactical weapons.

    https://www.ky3.com/content/news/Hea...528602951.html
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

  • #2
    From the articles I'm reading, people are speculating that he might have been an open carry activist who was flexing his rights in Missouri after the two recent incidences. It's a strange tactic by open carry activists to walk through heavily populated areas with AR-15s strapped to their back so that they can get into confrontations and explain the law to people. Here's some examples of it happening in different Walmarts.







    Comment


    • #3
      As I mentioned in the other thread, the tactic Adrift mentioned ended up backfiring by prompting several businesses to adopt no-carry policies.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

      Comment


      • #4
        Well there is "exercising your rights" and there is, "I am a complete moron, who thinks it's OK to brandish a loaded weapon in public"

        Comment


        • #5
          When this first started becoming a trend, the NRA website had a blog post up asking people not to do this because people find it "weird". A friend of mine (combat veteran and gun enthusiast) was pointing to this as an example of how most gun owners are reasonable at heart.

          Then the next day, they took down that post and put up a new one about how there was nothing wrong with exercising your rights. He was mad.
          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

          Comment


          • #6
            Walking around in public with a rifle slung around your neck? That is just asking for trouble and causing public panic. They might not be able to arrest you specifically for illegally carrying a rifle in public but they could get you for disturbing the peace or acting in a threatening manner.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Sparko View Post
              Well there is "exercising your rights" and there is, "I am a complete moron, who thinks it's OK to brandish a loaded weapon in public"
              This is where I'm 100% in support of tightening up the intent portion -- currently, most of these laws seem to require the police to show intent that the person was brandishing the weapon in a threatening manner...

              To me, it should be "in such a way that a reasonable person would be concerned" or something like that.

              Certainly, a guy openly carrying an AR-15 in Walmart after we just had a mass shooting in a Walmart is a GROSS abuse of the "right to bear arms" concept.
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                When this first started becoming a trend, the NRA website had a blog post up asking people not to do this because people find it "weird". A friend of mine (combat veteran and gun enthusiast) was pointing to this as an example of how most gun owners are reasonable at heart.
                This!!!

                Then the next day, they took down that post and put up a new one about how there was nothing wrong with exercising your rights. He was mad.
                Yeah, not that!
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'll have to review my CHL training material, but I THOUGHT it was the law in Texas that, when encountering a person with a firearm, the police officer has the legal right to require the armed person to temporarily surrender their weapon (for the officer's safety during the encounter) or to secure it.

                  But I think that the "out" is the fact that, in a traffic stop, the officer would already have had probable cause to temporarily detain the driver. In the case of somebody standing on the street with a weapon, there is no such probable cause.

                  (just publicly thinking this through )
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                    I'll have to review my CHL training material, but I THOUGHT it was the law in Texas that, when encountering a person with a firearm, the police officer has the legal right to require the armed person to temporarily surrender their weapon (for the officer's safety during the encounter) or to secure it.

                    But I think that the "out" is the fact that, in a traffic stop, the officer would already have had probable cause to temporarily detain the driver. In the case of somebody standing on the street with a weapon, there is no such probable cause.

                    (just publicly thinking this through )
                    I've seen a lot of these open carry videos (I only grabbed the few I could find quickly), and generally speaking it always seems like they end up getting away with it. I think the big problem is that, even if the officer is correct about it being a nuisance, they simply don't have the law memorized, whereas these sovereign citizen type guys will rattle off a bunch of laws (most of which do not apply), and get the officer all confused, and it becomes a hassle no one wants to deal with.

                    Recently there was a big open carry protest in some Southern state where a bunch of people were marching with AR-15s strapped to their backs, and I believe the chief of police got into some hot water for attempting to squelch it, even though it was freaking out people in the neighborhood who called the police. I'll have to see if I can find the article.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                      I've seen a lot of these open carry videos (I only grabbed the few I could find quickly), and generally speaking it always seems like they end up getting away with it. I think the big problem is that, even if the officer is correct about it being a nuisance, they simply don't have the law memorized, whereas these sovereign citizen type guys will rattle off a bunch of laws (most of which do not apply), and get the officer all confused, and it becomes a hassle no one wants to deal with.

                      Recently there was a big open carry protest in some Southern state where a bunch of people were marching with AR-15s strapped to their backs, and I believe the chief of police got into some hot water for attempting to squelch it, even though it was freaking out people in the neighborhood who called the police. I'll have to see if I can find the article.
                      I think it all comes down to "no probable cause". When the activist is within his legal rights, there is no official reason for the police to be interacting with him, so no legitimate reason to ID or detain. I think it's a case of bad law.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here's the incident I was thinking of,

                        https://www.kcentv.com/article/news/.../500-532698226

                        Here are a couple other similar incidences,

                        https://www.thestranger.com/slog/201...guns-on-campus

                        https://www.dailycamera.com/2018/04/...uring-protest/

                        After awhile you start seeing certain advocate names pop up a lot like C.J. Grisham and Joey Gibson.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          I think it all comes down to "no probable cause". When the activist is within his legal rights, there is no official reason for the police to be interacting with him, so no legitimate reason to ID or detain. I think it's a case of bad law.
                          I just wish the police knew the ordinances better, or at least had a list of city ordinances handy, because I've seen too many officers back down. For example, I remember one video where a open-carry guy was walking down a major highway's breakdown lane with an AR-15 strapped to his back. The police stopped him to see what he was up to, and, if I remember correctly, just let him on his way when he pointed out that he was well within his legal right. Drivers down the freeway were rightfully freaked out, but there wasn't much the police could do about it.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                            I just wish the police knew the ordinances better, or at least had a list of city ordinances handy, because I've seen too many officers back down. For example, I remember one video where a open-carry guy was walking down a major highway's breakdown lane with an AR-15 strapped to his back. The police stopped him to see what he was up to, and, if I remember correctly, just let him on his way when he pointed out that he was well within his legal right. Drivers down the freeway were rightfully freaked out, but there wasn't much the police could do about it.
                            See, to me that guy knew he would be freaking people out and scaring them and did it anyway, "because it was legal"

                            While it might be legal to carry the gun in public, causing a public panic is not. People could have been hurt in an attempt to get away from the guy for instance.

                            If some hunter were dressed up like a hunter and was carrying a shotgun or rifle around in a rural area where there are lots of such things going on, I don't see a problem. The context is that he is just going about his normal business and not trying to cause a panic. Take that same guy and put him in downtown New York and you have someone doing it to cause a panic. There is no hunting in downtown New York. No reason for someone to be carrying a rifle in public. It doesn't offer self defense, he could carry a handgun for that. It's only purpose is to "prove a point" while scaring people to post it on youtube.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                              See, to me that guy knew he would be freaking people out and scaring them and did it anyway, "because it was legal"

                              While it might be legal to carry the gun in public, causing a public panic is not. People could have been hurt in an attempt to get away from the guy for instance.

                              If some hunter were dressed up like a hunter and was carrying a shotgun or rifle around in a rural area where there are lots of such things going on, I don't see a problem. The context is that he is just going about his normal business and not trying to cause a panic. Take that same guy and put him in downtown New York and you have someone doing it to cause a panic. There is no hunting in downtown New York. No reason for someone to be carrying a rifle in public. It doesn't offer self defense, he could carry a handgun for that. It's only purpose is to "prove a point" while scaring people to post it on youtube.
                              The crazy thing is that the sov-cits are usually the ones posting it to Youtube themselves. As if they are so certain of their right-ness, that they make it a point to post the videos themselves proving to the world that they're right. They don't seem to understand that you can be legally right, and also still a jerk.

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