Announcement
Collapse
Civics 101 Guidelines
Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!
Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less
Trump Administration Whistleblower Cover-Up
Collapse
X
-
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot
"Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman
My Personal Blog
My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)
Quill Sword
-
Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostSays the person trying to desperately link Trump to a mob boss, repeating unsubstantiated roomers as fact. Trump is going to win in 2020 because of hysterical people, like you. Most of the political right sources I read started off as anti Trump (shoot so did I, as my 2016 post would show). Many of them have switched due to Democrat political dirty tricks. Democrats could have made Trump into a one term president, they created this monster and I enjoy watching them get crushed by it.
Comment
-
Originally posted by JimL View PostOne term? Democrats, because the republican congress has no principles, are hopefully going to make him less than a one term president. If the unprincipled majority Senate refuse to convict, then the Dems at least will have done the right and patriotic thing anyway by beginning the impeachment process, and when the fair objective minded republican constituency out there, (not you) see the evidence of his criminality and abuse of power, he will lose in a landslide. If not, then you'll get the dictator that you deserve!That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
Comment
-
Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostYou're such a huckster, Jim. Trump's not a dictator any more than you are a decent human being.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
Comment
-
Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostYou're such a huckster, Jim. Trump's not a dictator any more than you are a decent human being.
Comment
-
To swing back around to this, the Office of the ICIG released this today, confirming that:
1) The form used by the whistleblower had/has not been recently changed
2) The whistleblower attested to both direct and indirect knowledge regarding the complaint
3) The ICIG determined that the whistleblower's direct knowledge was credible and corroborated by other sources
This would be a good time for folks to assess the value of The Federalist and what, exactly, how the author should be treated as a journalistic source if he doesn't cop to the major error.
Originally posted by NorrinRadd View PostCould you please comment in light of this article?
Specifically,
"The internal properties of the newly revised “Disclosure of Urgent Concern” form, which the intelligence community inspector general (ICIG) requires to be submitted under the Intelligence Community Whistleblower Protection Act (ICWPA), show that the document was uploaded on September 24, 2019, at 4:25 p.m., just days before the anti-Trump complaint was declassified and released to the public. The markings on the document state that it was revised in August 2019, but no specific date of revision is disclosed.
...
A previous version of the whistleblower complaint document, which the ICIG and DNI until recently provided to potential whistleblowers, declared that any complaint must contain only first-hand knowledge of alleged wrongdoing and that complaints that provide only hearsay, rumor, or gossip would be rejected.
“The [Intelligence Community Inspector General] cannot transmit information via the ICPWA based on an employee’s second-hand knowledge of wrongdoing,” the previous form stated under the bolded heading “FIRST-HAND INFORMATION REQUIRED.” “This includes information received from another person, such as when an employee informs you that he/she witnessed some type of wrongdoing.”
“If you think that wrongdoing took place, but can provide nothing more than second-hand or unsubstantiated assertions, [the Intelligence Community Inspector General] will not be able to process the complaint or information for submission as an ICWPA,” the form concluded.
Markings on the previous version of the Disclosure of Urgent Concern form show that it was formally approved on May 24, 2018.""I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"
Comment
-
Originally posted by JimL View PostHe's a dictator at heart Bill. He's also a crook. His only problem is that he's a dictator and a crook at the head of a democracy, which so far is holding up. He's made one thing apparent though, he's exposed the cracks in the system that might allow the possibility of a corrupt authoritarian like himelf to bring the system down. Probably took instructions from his best bud Vladimir.
Comment
-
Originally posted by Sam View PostTo swing back around to this...
"The Disclosure of Urgent Concern form the Complainant submitted on August 12, 2019 is the same form the ICIG has had in place since May 24, 2018..."
Very first line in The Federalist article:
"Between May 2018 and August 2019, the intelligence community secretly eliminated a requirement that whistleblowers provide direct, first-hand knowledge of alleged wrongdoings."
Looks like he got the dates dead on accurate. You ask "how the author should be treated as a journalistic source if he doesn't cop to the major error," but it seems you're the one who made the "major error" by not bothering to read the source you were criticizing. Seriously, man, it was the very first line!
But I will gladly admit my own error: I was under the impression that the forms were changed right before the "whistleblower" stepped forward, but it seems they were changed over a year ago, and the public wasn't aware of the change until just recently. So I was wrong on that point. Still, it's a curious change to allow the reporting of complaints based on rumors and hearsay.Last edited by Mountain Man; 09-30-2019, 08:43 PM.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
Comment
-
Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostFrom the ICIG press release:"The Disclosure of Urgent Concern form the Complainant submitted on August 12, 2019 is the same form the ICIG has had in place since May 24, 2018..."
Very first line in The Federalist article:"Between May 2018 and August 2019, the intelligence community secretly eliminated a requirement that whistleblowers provide direct, first-hand knowledge of alleged wrongdoings."
Looks like he got the dates dead on accurate. You ask "how the author should be treated as a journalistic source if he doesn't cop to the major error," but it seems you're the one who made the "major error" by not bothering to read the source you were criticizing. Seriously, man, it was the very first line!
But I will gladly admit my own error: I was under the impression that the forms were changed right before the "whistleblower" stepped forward, but it seems they were changed over a year ago, and the public wasn't aware of the change until just recently. So I was wrong on that point. Still, it's a curious change to allow the reporting of complaints based on rumors and hearsay.
Yeah, no, nice try on that one but Davis' entire thrust was that this was a recent and secret change. Davis goes on to say that the "new" form was surreptitiously uploaded only days before the whistleblower complaint was made public and marked as sometime in August 2019. As you and others tried to argue, the whole idea was that a special accommodation was being invented for this whistleblower to go along with the other talking point (also refuted by the ICIG) that the whistleblower had no "firsthand" knowledge, making the complaint invalid.
So The Federalist and Davis got it very wrong by taking something true (the "new" form came into use in late May 2018) and extending the timeline ("sometime between May 2018 and August 2019") and extrapolating that into "the form was recently changed to set up Trump with this phony whistleblower". Mendacious is the appropriate word and it should affect how people use Davis' work going forward.
--Sam"I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"
Comment
-
Originally posted by RumTumTugger View PostRepeating the same non substantieted dishonest opinion does not make it true or a fact JimL it only shows you are a one trick pony and gets old.
Comment
-
Originally posted by Sam View PostYeah, no, nice try on that one but Davis' entire thrust was that this was a recent and secret change. Davis goes on to say that the "new" form was surreptitiously uploaded only days before the whistleblower complaint was made public and marked as sometime in August 2019. As you and others tried to argue, the whole idea was that a special accommodation was being invented for this whistleblower to go along with the other talking point (also refuted by the ICIG) that the whistleblower had no "firsthand" knowledge, making the complaint invalid.
So The Federalist and Davis got it very wrong by taking something true (the "new" form came into use in late May 2018) and extending the timeline ("sometime between May 2018 and August 2019") and extrapolating that into "the form was recently changed to set up Trump with this phony whistleblower". Mendacious is the appropriate word and it should affect how people use Davis' work going forward.
--Sam
Try reading the whole article. The writer never definitively declares that it was a recent change, and he states multiple times that it's unclear exactly when the changes were made. He even contacted the ICIG and asked for clarification, but they refused to comment, so the article leaves it an open question. By all accounts, he did his due diligence as a reporter.Last edited by Mountain Man; 09-30-2019, 09:58 PM.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
Comment
-
Originally posted by seer View PostTell me about it - I had one who would never clean his dirty dishes!Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.
Beige Federalist.
Nationalist Christian.
"Everybody is somebody's heretic."
Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.
Proud member of the this space left blank community.
Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.
Justice for Ashli Babbitt!
Justice for Matthew Perna!
Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!
Comment
-
Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostSays who?
So now “Experts are homing in on allegations that the White House used a computer system meant for highly classified information to store details of President Donald Trump’s calls with foreign leaders, in what they described as a stark departure from how the server is normally used and how memos of the president’s exchanges are typically handled”.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...script-1514714
In short, it's being used for a cover-up.“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
Comment
Related Threads
Collapse
Topics | Statistics | Last Post | ||
---|---|---|---|---|
Started by Cow Poke, Yesterday, 03:46 PM
|
0 responses
34 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by KingsGambit
Yesterday, 04:11 PM
|
||
Started by Ronson, Yesterday, 01:52 PM
|
1 response
28 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by Ronson
Yesterday, 10:46 PM
|
||
Started by Cow Poke, Yesterday, 09:08 AM
|
6 responses
58 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by RumTumTugger
Yesterday, 10:30 AM
|
||
Started by CivilDiscourse, Yesterday, 07:44 AM
|
0 responses
22 views
0 likes
|
Last Post Yesterday, 07:44 AM | ||
Started by seer, Yesterday, 07:04 AM
|
29 responses
197 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by oxmixmudd
Yesterday, 02:59 PM
|
Comment