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Thread: Take This Impeachment And Shove It...

  1. #2691
    tWebber
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    On the merits of impeachment:

    Here's a letter Giuliani sent to Zelensky (and apparently copied to Lev Parnas), asking for a meeting May 13 or 14. Giuliani takes pains to note that he is asking as Trump's personal attorney, not in pursuit of Trump's presidential duties, and that the meeting has Trump's full knowledge and consent. We know the context of the proposed meeting because Giuliani was telling NYT reporters around May 9 that he was traveling to Ukraine in order to push for investigations into Biden and Burisma for his client (Trump):

    Source: Rudy Giuliani Plans Ukraine Trip to Push for Inquiries That Could Help Trump. Ken Vogel. NYT. 2019.05.09

    Mr. Giuliani’s plans create the remarkable scene of a lawyer for the president of the United States pressing a foreign government to pursue investigations that Mr. Trump’s allies hope could help him in his re-election campaign. And it comes after Mr. Trump spent more than half of his term facing questions about whether his 2016 campaign conspired with a foreign power.

    “We’re not meddling in an election, we’re meddling in an investigation, which we have a right to do,” Mr. Giuliani said in an interview on Thursday when asked about the parallel to the special counsel’s inquiry.


    “There’s nothing illegal about it,” he said. “Somebody could say it’s improper. And this isn’t foreign policy — I’m asking them to do an investigation that they’re doing already and that other people are telling them to stop. And I’m going to give them reasons why they shouldn’t stop it because that information will be very, very helpful to my client, and may turn out to be helpful to my government.”

    © Copyright Original Source




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    Other documents released by HPSCI today indicate that Parnas and Robert F. Hyde, an American Trump ally running for Congress, were having Ambassador Yovanovitch's movements in Ukraine tracked and Hyde is on record talking about people in Ukraine "willing to help if you'd like a price" and how "[g]uess you can do anything in the Ukraine with money".

    Trump personally gave John Dowd permission to represent Parnas and Fruman, who have said they were working directly with Giuliani in Ukraine.

    Upshot: Giuliani, in May, was seeking a meeting with Zelensky to restart investigations into the Bidens as a personal and explicitly not as a presidential matter for Trump. Parnas, Giuliani, Trump, and others would continue to pressure the Zelensky administration for the public announcement of this investigation through September 7, when Trump told Sondland that Zelensky had to "get in front of the cameras".

    --Sam
    "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"


  2. Amen DivineOb amen'd this post.
  3. #2692
    tWebber
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    I predict this thread will become a ghost town really quick. We'll see :).

  4. #2693
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    What laws, if any, is the Trump administration being accused of breaking?
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  5. #2694
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    As always, required reading for anybody who wants to understand what's really going on:

    Yesterday’s ridiculous, albeit proactive, New York Times narrative about Russians hacking Burisma now makes sense. Today the Lawfare team (Mary McCord et al) within Adam Schiff’s impeachment crew send additional files of evidence (pdf below) to be included in the impeachment articles constructed by HJC Chairman Jerry Nadler.

    ...

    It is all coordinated. The “new evidence” relates to information turned over by Lev Parnas, an SDNY indicted former associate of Trump’s personal attorney Rudy Giuliani. The Lawfare purpose is to bolster their premise that President Trump was trying to force Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky to investigate Joe Biden’s corrupt activity around the Ukrainian company Burisma.

    The Lawfare crew behind Schiff waited until the last minute to push the new “evidence” because they didn’t want republicans to deconstruct it during the impeachment evidence gathering phase. Aditionally, the Lawfare crew anticipate a Trump impeachment defense surrounding actual evidence of the Biden corruption, which makes the Trump request to Zelensky valid.

    So the proactive democrat strategy was/is to use the New York Times presentation of Russia hacking Burisma to negate the provenance of the evidence against the Bidens. In essence, to cast doubt upon any documents that would show Joe and Hunter Biden participating in an actual influence and money-laundering scheme.

    ...

    The SDNY created legal leverage upon Lev Parnas using the familiar strategy of charging “FARA violations”, as noted in the background of the House explanation.

    The purpose was/is to extract anything from Parnas that could be twisted or construed to show evidence that Rudy Giuliani was working on behalf of President Trump to pressure Ukraine into investigating Burisma, Joe Biden and Hunter Biden.

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com...nce-to-nadler/
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  6. #2695
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    I predict this thread will become a ghost town really quick. We'll see :).
    I am not optimistic, as that would require that new information be absorbed when so many still have not incorporated the old, even after extensive repetition.

    --Sam
    "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"


  7. #2696
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    As always, required reading for anybody who wants to understand what's really going on:
    How nefarious of them to insinuate actions and motivations that Giuliani publicly asserted in May. How clever to release documents showing Trump associates planning to pressure Zelensky for investigations and stalking a US ambassador.

    A true conspiracy.

    --Sam
    "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"


  8. #2697
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    How nefarious of them to insinuate actions and motivations that Giuliani publicly asserted in May. How clever to release documents showing Trump associates planning to pressure Zelensky for investigations and stalking a US ambassador.

    A true conspiracy.

    --Sam
    Let's wait for the cross examination and vetting process before making any declarations about the quality of this evidence. I mean, a handwritten note with little asterisks on it? What, like he was going to forget and had to jot it down on hotel stationary? Who knows when it was really written, and for what purpose.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  9. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  10. #2698
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Let's wait for the cross examination and vetting process before making any declarations about the quality of this evidence. I mean, a handwritten note with little asterisks on it? What, like he was going to forget and had to jot it down on hotel stationary? Who knows when it was really written, and for what purpose.
    Good to see you on board with calling witnesses in the Senate trial.

    --Sam
    "I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / So close to our dwelling place?" — Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"


  11. Amen JimL amen'd this post.
  12. #2699
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    Good to see you on board with calling witnesses in the Senate trial.

    --Sam
    I was never against it, at least in principle. The question has always been whether or not the Democrats will be able to deliver a compelling enough opening argument to convince a simple majority of the Senate that the trial should go forward.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  13. #2700
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    I was never against it, at least in principle.

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