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  • #91
    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
    Um... not even close.
    Slick effect?

    How is it "not even close"? It did show some ideas elites within the body of Christ.

    Comment


    • #92
      Kanye just produced a song for Lil Nas X (popular rapper who raps about his homosexuality in graphic detail, and who recently had a music video where he descends to Hell and gives a lap dance to Satan). Yuck.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
        Kanye just produced a song for Lil Nas X (popular rapper who raps about his homosexuality in graphic detail, and who recently had a music video where he descends to Hell and gives a lap dance to Satan). Yuck.
        I'm now of the belief that for someone to genuinely convert to the faith, they'd have to completely remove themselves from the entertainment industry. The evil of Hollywood is so powerful that there's no hope of influencing that culture. Eventually it's going to influence you if you stay engaged with it.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by seanD View Post

          I'm now of the belief that for someone to genuinely convert to the faith, they'd have to completely remove themselves from the entertainment industry. The evil of Hollywood is so powerful that there's no hope of influencing that culture. Eventually it's going to influence you if you stay engaged with it.
          Keith Green's conversion was a good example of how this might look like in person. When he converted in the middle of his rising music career, he set his career aside to see what he thought God wanted him to do. He eventually came to the conclusion that he could continue as a Christian singer, and his career was unmistakably gospel-focused. Kanye West on the other hand, appears to have tried to change as little about his career as possible other than having religious themed lyrics.

          Green wasn't a mega-star, of course, so he didn't have as much to lose as somebody like Kanye West.

          It also depends on where in the entertainment industry you are. An actor is going to find it nearly impossible given that even PG rated movies casually take the Lord's name in vain. A musician might find it easier, though it depends on genre (many top country musicians are professing Christians, though I don't know what happens behind the scene; with rap, it's a different game). An athlete shouldn't have any problem continuing in their career unless it's a blood sport like UFC/boxing/MMA that Christians shouldn't be doing anyway.
          Last edited by KingsGambit; 10-01-2021, 08:19 PM.
          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post

            Keith Green's conversion was a good example of how this might look like in person. When he converted in the middle of his rising music career, he set his career aside to see what he thought God wanted him to do. He eventually came to the conclusion that he could continue as a Christian singer, and his career was unmistakably gospel-focused. Kanye West on the other hand, appears to have tried to change as little about his career as possible other than having religious themed lyrics.

            Green wasn't a mega-star, of course, so he didn't have as much to lose as somebody like Kanye West.

            It also depends on where in the entertainment industry you are. An actor is going to find it nearly impossible given that even PG rated movies casually take the Lord's name in vain. A musician might find it easier, though it depends on genre (many top country musicians are professing Christians, though I don't know what happens behind the scene; with rap, it's a different game). An athlete shouldn't have any problem continuing in their career unless it's a blood sport like UFC/boxing/MMA that Christians shouldn't be doing anyway.
            Keith Green did a lot of free concert stuff back in those days - I think he was hanging out with Agape Force out of Lindale, Texas (I used to live in Tyler).

            As I recall, he really got into charity stuff.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

              Keith Green did a lot of free concert stuff back in those days - I think he was hanging out with Agape Force out of Lindale, Texas (I used to live in Tyler).

              As I recall, he really got into charity stuff.
              The question of whether your life is any different as a Christian or not - that answer seems pretty clear with him.
              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post

                Keith Green's conversion was a good example of how this might look like in person. When he converted in the middle of his rising music career, he set his career aside to see what he thought God wanted him to do. He eventually came to the conclusion that he could continue as a Christian singer, and his career was unmistakably gospel-focused. Kanye West on the other hand, appears to have tried to change as little about his career as possible other than having religious themed lyrics.

                Green wasn't a mega-star, of course, so he didn't have as much to lose as somebody like Kanye West.

                It also depends on where in the entertainment industry you are. An actor is going to find it nearly impossible given that even PG rated movies casually take the Lord's name in vain. A musician might find it easier, though it depends on genre (many top country musicians are professing Christians, though I don't know what happens behind the scene; with rap, it's a different game). An athlete shouldn't have any problem continuing in their career unless it's a blood sport like UFC/boxing/MMA that Christians shouldn't be doing anyway.
                Well, I disagree with your opinion about UFC/boxing/MMA, but in regards to West, it could always be that he was simply grifting, whereas Green's conversion was legit. West probably saw a very lucrative market he never tapped into before and seized the moment. Maybe that's being a bit cynical, but it is Hollywood after all.
                Last edited by seanD; 10-02-2021, 01:47 AM.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Interesting how we all have our own ideas about what "Christians shouldn't be doing."

                  I also have issues with Christians participating in sports where the direct intent is to hurt an opponent, but in light of the fact that Paul seems to use boxing as a positive example in 1 Cor. 9:26, I definitely can't say it's "wrong" for Christians to engage in them.
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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post

                    The question of whether your life is any different as a Christian or not - that answer seems pretty clear with him.
                    Haven't even heard a mention of him in the last 10 years or so, but, yeah, at the time, he really stood out as different from the others.
                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by seanD View Post
                      Well, I disagree with your opinion about UFC/boxing/MMA, but in regards to West, it could always be that he was simply grifting, whereas Green's conversion was legit. West probably saw a very lucrative market he never tapped into before and seized the moment. Maybe that's being a bit cynical, but it is Hollywood after all.
                      I had hoped, but with reservation, that he was actually taking a courageous stand for Christ, but I also kept in mind he's not the most stable person I've ever seen, so...

                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                        Interesting how we all have our own ideas about what "Christians shouldn't be doing."

                        I also have issues with Christians participating in sports where the direct intent is to hurt an opponent, but in light of the fact that Paul seems to use boxing as a positive example in 1 Cor. 9:26, I definitely can't say it's "wrong" for Christians to engage in them.
                        I'm of the belief that even the gladiator games that fought to the death weren't sin, as long as the participants weren't forced into doing it against their will, and if that was the case, then the sin falls on those doing the forcing, not the participants. But for someone to say that modern contact sports is sin is pretty absurd, and quite judgemental against the myriad number of Christians that participate in contact sports.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post

                          Keith Green's conversion was a good example of how this might look like in person. When he converted in the middle of his rising music career, he set his career aside to see what he thought God wanted him to do. He eventually came to the conclusion that he could continue as a Christian singer, and his career was unmistakably gospel-focused. Kanye West on the other hand, appears to have tried to change as little about his career as possible other than having religious themed lyrics.

                          Green wasn't a mega-star, of course, so he didn't have as much to lose as somebody like Kanye West.

                          It also depends on where in the entertainment industry you are. An actor is going to find it nearly impossible given that even PG rated movies casually take the Lord's name in vain. A musician might find it easier, though it depends on genre (many top country musicians are professing Christians, though I don't know what happens behind the scene; with rap, it's a different game). An athlete shouldn't have any problem continuing in their career unless it's a blood sport like UFC/boxing/MMA that Christians shouldn't be doing anyway.
                          Personally, I think Christian values is why some actors and actresses migrate to channels like Hallmark. It's interesting to see how many names I recognize from secular shows are there now.
                          "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                          "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                          Comment


                          • I don't see how one can reconcile a Christian ethic of loving one's brother with a sport where the goal is to intentionally inflict pain and suffering (I would differentiate this with other sports like basketball or football where injuries can happen but the goal is not to intentionally maim). The early Christian fathers were vehemently against the gladiatorial games for that reason. Paul using boxing as an analogy does not mean that he actually endorsed the activity.
                            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                              I don't see how one can reconcile a Christian ethic of loving one's brother with a sport where the goal is to intentionally inflict pain and suffering (I would differentiate this with other sports like basketball or football where injuries can happen but the goal is not to intentionally maim). The early Christian fathers were vehemently against the gladiatorial games for that reason. Paul using boxing as an analogy does not mean that he actually endorsed the activity.
                              From what I understand the ECFs were against the gladiator games because of the pagan spectacle surrounding it. Nonetheless, neither Jesus nor any of the apostles said anything about it, and you'd certainly think they would have addressed whether or not Christians should partake in it if it was that much of a sin to do so.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by seanD View Post

                                From what I understand the ECFs were against the gladiator games because of the pagan spectacle surrounding it. Nonetheless, neither Jesus nor any of the apostles said anything about it, and you'd certainly think they would have addressed whether or not Christians should partake in it if it was that much of a sin to do so.
                                In a way, that's an argument from silence, but not terribly unreasonable. That Paul goes on and pretty much compares the Christian life to the games adds something, also.
                                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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