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Sondland admits quid pro quo

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  • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    That's some mighty fine spin, but the plain fact is that Sondland testified under oath that he was never told by the President or anybody else on the planet that the release of aid was tied to Ukraine agreeing to undertake certain investigations, and contemporaneous text messages show that he clearly understood and communicated this fact to Bill Taylor.

    And, yes, if the Democrats want to convince us that Trump should be impeached and removed from office then they darn well better have some conclusive evidence that he is guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors. But so far, witness after witness has said that while they may have disagreed with Trump's approach to foreign policy, none of them were concerned about the legality of his negotiations.

    Not Trump, not Giuliani, not ANYONE.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

    Comment


    • Originally posted by seer View Post
      Not Trump, not Giuliani, not ANYONE.
      Representative Mike Turner: “Okay. Well, you know, after you testified, Chairman Schiff ran out and gave a press conference and said he gets to impeach the president of the United States because of your testimony, and if you pull up CNN today right now their banner says: Sondland Ties Trump to Withholding Aid. Is that your testimony today, Ambassador Sondland, that you have evidence that Donald Trump tied the investigation to the aid, because I don’t think you’re saying that?”

      Sondland: “I’ve said repeatedly, congressman, I was presuming. I also said that President Trump never—“

      Turner: “So, no one told you. Not just the president? Giuliani didn’t tell you. Mulvaney didn’t tell you. Nobody. Pompeo didn’t tell you. Nobody else on this planet told you that Donald Trump was tying aid to these investigations? Is that correct?”

      Sondland: “I think I already testified to that.”

      Turner: “No, answer the question: Is it correct? No one on this planet told you that Donald Trump was tying this aid to the investigation? Because if your answer is yes then the chairman’s wrong and the headline on CNN is wrong. No one on this planet told you that President Trump was tying aid to investigations? Yes or no?”

      Sondland: “Yes.”

      Turner: “So, you really have no testimony that ties President Trump to a scheme to withhold aid from Ukraine in exchange for these investigations?”

      Sondland: “Other than my own presumption.”

      Turner: “Which is nothing.”

      https://www.cnsnews.com/index.php/ar...rump-was-tying

      Yet liberals keep trying to convince us that Sondland's testimony was somehow damning to Trump, and I keep asking myself, "What hearing did they watch?"
      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
      Than a fool in the eyes of God


      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
        Yet liberals keep trying to convince us that Sondland's testimony was somehow damning to Trump, and I keep asking myself, "What hearing did they watch?"
        They are depending on the spin of the media...
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

        Comment


        • Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
          Than a fool in the eyes of God


          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
            Representative Mike Turner: “Okay. Well, you know, after you testified, Chairman Schiff ran out and gave a press conference and said he gets to impeach the president of the United States because of your testimony, and if you pull up CNN today right now their banner says: Sondland Ties Trump to Withholding Aid. Is that your testimony today, Ambassador Sondland, that you have evidence that Donald Trump tied the investigation to the aid, because I don’t think you’re saying that?”

            Sondland: “I’ve said repeatedly, congressman, I was presuming. I also said that President Trump never—“

            Turner: “So, no one told you. Not just the president? Giuliani didn’t tell you. Mulvaney didn’t tell you. Nobody. Pompeo didn’t tell you. Nobody else on this planet told you that Donald Trump was tying aid to these investigations? Is that correct?”

            Sondland: “I think I already testified to that.”

            Turner: “No, answer the question: Is it correct? No one on this planet told you that Donald Trump was tying this aid to the investigation? Because if your answer is yes then the chairman’s wrong and the headline on CNN is wrong. No one on this planet told you that President Trump was tying aid to investigations? Yes or no?”

            Sondland: “Yes.”

            Turner: “So, you really have no testimony that ties President Trump to a scheme to withhold aid from Ukraine in exchange for these investigations?”

            Sondland: “Other than my own presumption.”

            Turner: “Which is nothing.”

            https://www.cnsnews.com/index.php/ar...rump-was-tying

            Yet liberals keep trying to convince us that Sondland's testimony was somehow damning to Trump, and I keep asking myself, "What hearing did they watch?"
            This one?

            Adam Schiff: 01:01:01 I thank the gentleman for yielding. Just to want to point out a couple things Ambassador. In response to my colleagues, my colleagues seem to be under the impression that unless the president spoke the words Ambassador Sondland, I am bribing the Ukrainian president, that there is no evidence of bribery if he didn’t say Ambassador Sondland, I’m telling you I’m not going to give the aid unless they do this. That there's no evidence of a quid pro quo on military aid.

            Adam Schiff: 01:01:35 But nonetheless Ambassador, you’ve given us a lot of evidence of precisely that conditionality of both the White House meeting and the military assistance. You’ve told us Ambassador, have you not, that you emailed the Secretary of State and said that if these investigations were announced, the new justice person was put in place, that the Ukrainians would be prepared to give the President what he wants.
            Adam Schiff: 01:02:00 The Ukrainians were prepared to give the president what he wants, and that would break the log jam. You’ve testified and showed us documents about this, have you not, Ambassador?

            Gordon Sondland: 01:02:10 I have.
            Sondland: (29:07)
            I know that members of this committee frequently frame these complicated issues in the form of a simple question. Was there a quid pro quo? As I testified previously with regard to the requested White House call and the White House meeting, the answer is yes. Mr. Giuliani conveyed to Secretary Perry, Ambassador Volker and others that President Trump wanted a public statement from President Zelensky committing to investigations of Burisma and the 2016 election. Mr. Giuliani expressed those requests directly to the Ukrainians and Mr. Giuliani also expressed those requests directly to us. We all understood that these prerequisites for the White House call and the White House meeting reflected President Trump’s desires and requirements
            https://www.rev.com/blog/impeachment...land-testifies
            "Yes. President Trump is a huge embarrassment. And it’s an embarrassment to evangelical Christianity that there appear to be so many who will celebrate precisely the aspects that I see Biblically as most lamentable and embarrassing." Southern Baptist leader Albert Mohler Jr.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Charles View Post
              As a bit of comic relief, I saw this comment in a review of the Democratic debates and it just reminded me so much of our debates here:

              Source: CNN

              After spending all day watching Republican congressmen (and one Republican congresswoman) during the impeachment hearings mindlessly denying the Everest of evidence of Donald Trump's alleged criminality, the Democratic debate was like a wake-up call from the real world.

              © Copyright Original Source



              Now I have my problems with many of the positions of the Democratic candidates. But they at least seem to have the capacity to recognize reality as regards what has been testified to in these impeachment hearings.

              With the GOP in climate change denial mode, chasing after insane alternate reality stories tossed out there by Putin and engaged in smear campaigns against our decorated heros promoted to defend a draft dodger, liar, and all around bad person, one feels that the Republican party, my party, seems to have become the resting place for the ignorant and the foolish. Just hard to fathom.
              My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

              If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

              This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Charles View Post
                But then Sondland later admitted this was all based on his own presumption and that he was never given an explicit or implicit directive from the President or anybody else on the planet, and in fact he testified that when he spoke to the President directly, he was told curtly and with no ambiguity that there was to be no quid pro quo.
                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                  But then Sondland later admitted this was all based on his own presumption and that he was never given an explicit or implicit directive from the President or anybody else on the planet, and in fact he testified that when he spoke to the President directly, he was told curtly and with no ambiguity that there was to be no quid pro quo.
                  I love that you keep repeating that as if it actually means anything. "No your honor, I promise I didn't do anything wrong! REALLY!!!" It's just hilarious.
                  My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                  If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                  This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
                    I love that you keep repeating that as if it actually means anything. "No your honor, I promise I didn't do anything wrong! REALLY!!!" It's just hilarious.
                    It's probably a good thing you're not an attorney, because I have a feeling that you would lose every case with your habit of cavalierly dismissing whatever hard facts don't fit your narrative.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                      I came here to see how you are psychologically coping with today's testimony being absolutely damning for Trump.

                      I guess the answer is that there's no level of reality or evidence you can't spin.
                      What evidence Starlight. presumptions and opinions are not evidence that is all we've heard so far.

                      here's a question for Starlight and all the other Trump haters here on this board.

                      What outcome did Trump ask for in the phone call to the Ukraine President? oh and cite from the transcript where it is.
                      Last edited by RumTumTugger; 11-21-2019, 11:14 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                        It's probably a good thing you're not an attorney, because I have a feeling that you would lose every case with your habit of cavalierly dismissing whatever hard facts don't fit your narrative.
                        You sure you’re not talking about yourself?

                        I love that you emphasize Sondland “said under oath” without ever realizing the dozens of witnesses confirming QPQ who similarly took that pledge and would be risking perjury if they’re all lying.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by RumTumTugger View Post
                          What evidence Starlight. presumptions and opinions are not evidence that is all we've heard so far.

                          here's a question for Starlight and all the other Trump haters here on this board.

                          What outcome did Trump ask for in the phone call to the Ukraine President?
                          Clearly the outcome he wanted was for Ukraine to announce an investigation publicly but not really do the investigation. Gee, I wonder why.

                          It’s not just about this phone call, though the call was relevant because it was revealed later he didn’t actually want an investigation.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                            But then Sondland later admitted this was all based on his own presumption and that he was never given an explicit or implicit directive from the President or anybody else on the planet, and in fact he testified that when he spoke to the President directly, he was told curtly and with no ambiguity that there was to be no quid pro quo.
                            Most of what I qouted was said after the part you refer to, so for that reason alone your "But then Sondland later " does not really describe what happened since that happened before and not later. If you had read the source that does not nitpick but contains everything that was said you would have known.

                            It also appears you (probably because you missed the context) did not understand it was a correction of exactly the interpretation you have given. In other words the source you point to left out important parts.
                            Last edited by Charles; 11-21-2019, 11:27 AM.
                            "Yes. President Trump is a huge embarrassment. And it’s an embarrassment to evangelical Christianity that there appear to be so many who will celebrate precisely the aspects that I see Biblically as most lamentable and embarrassing." Southern Baptist leader Albert Mohler Jr.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by whag View Post
                              You sure you’re not talking about yourself?

                              I love that you emphasize Sondland “said under oath” without ever realizing the dozens of witnesses confirming QPQ who similarly took that pledge and would be risking perjury if they’re all lying.
                              In fact, a number of witnesses have testified under oath that there was no quid pro quo, no bribery, no extortion, and no witness has said that they had any concerns about the legality of Trump's negotiations with Ukraine even if they didn't agree with his approach to foreign policy.
                              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                              Than a fool in the eyes of God


                              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Chuckles View Post
                                Most of what I qouted was said after the part you refer to, so for that reason alone your "But then Sondland later " does not really describe what happened since that happened before and not later. If you had read the source that does not nitpick but contains everything that was said you would have known.

                                It also appears you (probably because you missed the context) did not understand it was a correction of exactly the interpretation you have given. In other words the source you point to left out important parts.
                                So at best, Sondland gave contradictory answers.

                                But the one point he has been consistent on is that the President told him with the utmost clarity that there was to be no quid pro quo.
                                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                                Comment

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