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Thread: How Scientists Got Climate Change So Wrong

  1. #131
    tWebber Teallaura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    I will stick with the ethical support of science, and not the acride rhetoric and personal attacks you resort to.
    From the guy who started out by attacking me and my religion with his very first post?! Not only are those imaginary ethics not working out for you, your memory is failing as well.

    The real science is the methodology used to study the world. Anything beyond that is just delusional thinking that takes something pretty danged cool and dirties it.

  2. #132
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teallaura View Post
    From the guy who started out by attacking me and my religion with his very first post?! Not only are those imaginary ethics not working out for you, your memory is failing as well.

    The real science is the methodology used to study the world. Anything beyond that is just delusional thinking that takes something pretty danged cool and dirties it.
    I will stick with the ethical support of science, and not the acride rhetoric and personal attacks you resort to.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  3. #133
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLurch View Post
    Again, it depends on what figure you want to look at. There's strong consensus on many figures. Whether that consensus is enough to act is a value judgement. I understand where you stand on that value judgement, and it's not my goal to talk you into a different position.
    Consensus on what precisely? What range? A range of sea levels rise from 0.1cm to 100cm within the next 50 years will have consensus, because that's such a broad prediction.

    I'm just trying to make sure people have a strong factual basis to use as a foundation for forming that judgement.
    My strong factual basis is that accurate prediction of complex and chaotic systems is extremely difficult. You and others want radical changes to society, but in public there's no good justification for that change beyond 'there is 90%+ consensus that AGW is significant'. There is no similar consensus on whether AGW will have an overall negative impact.
    Trump is basically "Bruce Wayne pretending to be a foppish retarded billionaire" tier genius, in case nerds need a simpler metaphor.

  4. #134
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    Unless we can get past 'is the world really warming' and 'are we the cause' there can be no mitigation, regardless of it's potential impact.

    The political and business forces at play here are all using basic public ignorance to stall the impact to themselves in terms of $$$ or continued employment as politicians to muddy the waters. And unfortunately ignorance of science is a fairly useful partner, because here in the US we have a large evangelical base that has been thoroughly conditioned to both fear science and accept global conspiracy theories through the twin arms of organizations like AIG and ICR and 'end times escatology' that tries to find fitting maps of the symbology in Revelation to existing political and scientific advances.

    And it doesn't help that there are a non trivial number of high visibility scientists out there campaigning vocally against these same religious beliefs rather than trying to create bridges between the scientific and religious communities.
    Who cares, when China and India industrialising is sufficient to push CO2 levels past another dozen dozens of 'points of no return'?
    Trump is basically "Bruce Wayne pretending to be a foppish retarded billionaire" tier genius, in case nerds need a simpler metaphor.

  5. #135
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLurch View Post
    I'm just trying to make sure people have a strong factual basis to use as a foundation for forming that judgement.
    I want to clarify what facts I believe. I believe that human industrial activity has caused some warming. That's all, about the rest I'm appropriately agnostic or skeptical, how much warming, whether it is significant compared to past temperature variations, all the way to 'the sky is falling'.

    There is too much political power, money, and cultic morality behind 'the sky is falling'. The conflation involved in 'trust climate science because physics is accurate' is fodder for the gullible. Scientists are not superhuman, and any branch of science is still a human endeavour. The statistics involved in this particular case are so easily massaged.

    Any one of politics, money, and cultic morality is enough to ruin an 'objective truth-finding' human endeavour. When all three are present in massive quantities, the only appropriate response for any rational man is massive skepticism.
    Trump is basically "Bruce Wayne pretending to be a foppish retarded billionaire" tier genius, in case nerds need a simpler metaphor.

  6. #136
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demi-conservative View Post
    Who cares, when China and India industrialising is sufficient to push CO2 levels past another dozen dozens of 'points of no return'?
    I think I might take the Climate Alarmists more seriously if they were focusing their attention on the biggest polluters.
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  7. Amen Teallaura amen'd this post.
  8. #137
    tWebber Teallaura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    I will stick with the ethical support of science, and not the acride rhetoric and personal attacks you resort to.
    Might wanna clean that record - it's skipping on the crazy part again.

    Also, there isn't an e in acrid.

  9. #138
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teallaura View Post
    Might wanna clean that record - it's skipping on the crazy part again.

    Also, there isn't an e in acrid.
    Meaning does not change. We always need an anal grammarian to fail to respond coherently with personal attacks, and point out silly errors.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

  10. #139
    tWebber Teallaura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shunyadragon View Post
    Meaning does not change. We always need an anal grammarian to fail to respond coherently with personal attacks, and point out silly errors.
    Can't remember starting off by attacking me and can't spell. Well, at least it keeps you off the streets... Kinda wondering about drugs, though...

  11. #140
    tWebber shunyadragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teallaura View Post
    Can't remember starting off by attacking me and can't spell. Well, at least it keeps you off the streets... Kinda wondering about drugs, though...
    will stick with the ethical support of science, and not the acrid rhetoric and personal attacks you resort to, and no funny faces on drugs. {spelling corrected for your benefit)
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

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