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Thread: Trump issues at least two pardons to service members

  1. #71
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    I am dealing with facts, CP, you are not. It's not what liberaltalkingpointsfordummies says, it's what a military court said.
    You really do not know the facts, Jim.

    You were not in that court. You don't know what was presented. You don't know any of the actual facts of the case, and it is not at all unusual for the results of military tribunals to be set aside. Subsequent appeals can lesson or negate the punishment, but can never increase the punishment.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    You really do not know the facts, Jim.

    You were not in that court. You don't know what was presented. You don't know any of the actual facts of the case, and it is not at all unusual for the results of military tribunals to be set aside. Subsequent appeals can lesson or negate the punishment, but can never increase the punishment.
    No, I do not know the facts, and neither do you, but those who found them guilty did know the facts and found them guilty of murder, of ordering others to murder unarmed men, and of desecrating dead bodies. Subsequent appeals are subsequent appeals, the presidents pardon was nothing but an undermining of justice for his own personal political ends.

  3. #73
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    No, I do not know the facts
    Finally said something true!
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  4. #74
    tWebber demi-conservative's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    FTR, I pretty much think "rules" of war are stupid. If something is important enough to go to war about, the main "rule" should be "win."
    It does seem a ridiculous posture. "We're going to kill you to take over you/defend ourselves, but we need to be gentlemen about it." But it helps the more conscientious soldiers live with themselves after the fighting.

    Clearly the military was being unreasonably hamstrung by rules of engagement under Obama, and Trump is doing what he can to reverse some of the damage.
    Trump is basically "Bruce Wayne pretending to be a foppish retarded billionaire" tier genius, in case nerds need a simpler metaphor.

  5. #75
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    You really do not know the facts, Jim.

    You were not in that court. You don't know what was presented. You don't know any of the actual facts of the case, and it is not at all unusual for the results of military tribunals to be set aside. Subsequent appeals can lesson or negate the punishment, but can never increase the punishment.
    Anyone else here think that if it had been a Democrat president who pardoned them that little jimmy and shuny would be leading the praises for his compassion and sense of justice?

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
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  6. #76
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    My main concern would be the non-combatants who are, in military terms, "collateral damage". If both sides could get their soldiers together away from the civilian population and nuke it out, that'd be different.
    When one side (Muslim extremists) has a long history of launching missiles from hospitals and schools and using ambulance to transport weapons I would not hold my breath.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

  7. Amen Teallaura amen'd this post.
  8. #77
    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    These men were tried and were found guilty of desecration, of murder, and of ordering murder. Stop making excuses for them. Trump is pardoning them for one reason and one reason only, he thinks it will benefit himself politically.
    Obama pardoned 64 individuals and commuted the sentence of 209 individuals (109 of whom faced life sentences). These included Chelsea Manning and Oscar López Rivera, enabling them to be released from prison on May 17, 2017.

    Obama holds the record for the largest single-day use of the clemency power, granting 330 commutations on January 19, 2017, his last full day in office.[5][6] He also issued more commutations than the past 13 presidents combined.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...y_Barack_Obama
    Obama pardons enemies of the US and you get upset when Trump pardons patriots! Twisted...
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

  9. Amen Cow Poke, Teallaura amen'd this post.
  10. #78
    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    I don't really know the answer to that. But we are talking about shooting combatants in POW camps and/or that are surrendering. And those are war crimes. I don't believe it is in anyone's best interests to ignore those rules of war. And just how exactly are you going to prosecute General X for using chemical weapons if we turn around and use them too. And exactly by what authority would we go in ad get rid of some nations chemical weapons supply if we did not not agree it was wrong to use them. And so on.
    You prosecute General X because you won the war. That is the way it works Jim, we fire bombed Tokyo which was a war crime. General Curtis LeMay, the general who ran the operations, knew that. But we won and turned around and tried Japanese for war crimes. Don't be pollyannaish Jim...

    To quote LeMay: Killing Japanese didn't bother me very much at that time... I suppose if I had lost the war, I would have been tried as a war criminal.... Every soldier thinks something of the moral aspects of what he is doing. But all war is immoral and if you let that bother you, you're not a good soldier.

    You are advocating for anarchy. For the removal of what little restraint exists.
    I'm advocating victory.
    Last edited by seer; 11-19-2019 at 05:50 AM.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by seer View Post
    I'm advocating victory.
    At the cost of our souls, sadly. Not a price worth paying.

  12. #80
    tWebber seer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    At the cost of our souls, sadly. Not a price worth paying.
    Think of a world dominated by the Stalinists, Maoists, Nazis or radical Muslims. Yes it is a price worth paying...
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

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