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Thread: Benny Hinn... with a side of Costi

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    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Benny Hinn... with a side of Costi

    So, about ten weeks ago, Benny famously renounced "Prosperity Gospel" preaching.

    I don't keep up with the world of televangelism. Has he carried through with this? The first page of Google hits all seemed to be from September.

    I know his nephew Costi opposed his prosperity preaching, and published a book on the topic. I can't say I'm much more impressed with Costi than I am with Benny. He started a Facebook page just in time to launch the book, and AFAICT has not been back to it in about four months. And he seems to be allying himself with teachers that are *almost* as far off the road as Benny, but on the other side.
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    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    So, about ten weeks ago, Benny famously renounced "Prosperity Gospel" preaching.

    I don't keep up with the world of televangelism. Has he carried through with this? The first page of Google hits all seemed to be from September.

    I know his nephew Costi opposed his prosperity preaching, and published a book on the topic. I can't say I'm much more impressed with Costi than I am with Benny. He started a Facebook page just in time to launch the book, and AFAICT has not been back to it in about four months. And he seems to be allying himself with teachers that are *almost* as far off the road as Benny, but on the other side.
    Where would you like Costi to sit? Somewhere in the middle between truth and error? Where would you like someone who comes out of another false religion, let's say, Mormonism, to sit? Somewhere between Mormonism and Christianity?


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    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mossrose View Post
    Where would you like Costi to sit? Somewhere in the middle between truth and error? Where would you like someone who comes out of another false religion, let's say, Mormonism, to sit? Somewhere between Mormonism and Christianity?
    I'd prefer he not be so cozy with people who have said Arminians are "barely" saved, who regard all Pentecostals and Charismatics as dangerous lunatics and likely heretics, and who are flat-out patriarchalists.

    I regard Calvinism, cessationism, and patriarchalism all as "errors." And depending on how aggressively they are presented, I consider them as harmful as Benny's. So for me, Costi is not sitting "between" truth and error, he has just exchanged one set of errors for another.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

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    Oops....... mossrose's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    I'd prefer he not be so cozy with people who have said Arminians are "barely" saved, who regard all Pentecostals and Charismatics as dangerous lunatics and likely heretics, and who are flat-out patriarchalists.

    I regard Calvinism, cessationism, and patriarchalism all as "errors." And depending on how aggressively they are presented, I consider them as harmful as Benny's. So for me, Costi is not sitting "between" truth and error, he has just exchanged one set of errors for another.
    You and I have always disagreed on these matters, and always will, it seems.

    I came from an Arminian background. There are errors in their doctrine. I think that many Charismatics and Pentecostals are WAY too focused on experience, and are in danger of falling deeper into WoF fallacies, but I don't doubt that the majority of them are "saved", just as I don't doubt that many in Arminianism are "saved".

    I am a cessationist.

    I am what you are calling a patriarchalist, if by that you are referring to women teaching men.

    There are four options here. You can accept what scripture says on the matter, you can ignore what scripture says, you can twist scripture to suit your own purposes, or you can reject scripture altogether. That's it, there isn't anything else.

    I am thankful that Costi has come out of the WoF movement and is on the path of truth.


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    IMO, cessationist belief is mostly self-fulfilling; if you don't believe it happens, you're not going to bother trying.
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    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mossrose View Post
    You and I have always disagreed on these matters, and always will, it seems.
    Yes. Opinions are often slow to change, and slower to change back. I've changed on a few things, moved back slightly on some. None of that was *directly* due to online discussions.

    I came from an Arminian background. There are errors in their doctrine. I think that many Charismatics and Pentecostals are WAY too focused on experience, and are in danger of falling deeper into WoF fallacies, but I don't doubt that the majority of them are "saved", just as I don't doubt that many in Arminianism are "saved".
    I think some Pentecostals and Charismatics are too focused on experiences, too unwilling to examine them, and too casual and superficial about doctrine. But I think cessationists are too leery of experiences. (Honestly, *I* am probably a bit too timid about them.)

    I am a cessationist.

    I am what you are calling a patriarchalist, if by that you are referring to women teaching men.
    Yes. I realize the term can be taken as a pejorative. I believe it is more accurate and precise than "complementarian," since egalitarians also believe that men and women are not interchangeable but rather complementary, albeit not in a hierarchical sense. Also, Scot McKnight has presented reasonable evidence that egalitarians were the first to use the language of "complementarity," but that patriarchalists adopted it because it sounds less off-putting to modern ears.


    There are four options here. You can accept what scripture says on the matter, you can ignore what scripture says, you can twist scripture to suit your own purposes, or you can reject scripture altogether. That's it, there isn't anything else.
    But surely you realize that those who disagree with you on each of the areas under discussion believe that "what Scripture says" supports our views, more than it supports your views. We interpret Scripture differently. Why ascribe malice via terms such as "ignore," "twist," and "reject"?


    I am thankful that Costi has come out of the WoF movement and is on the path of truth.
    Agreed at least regarding the former.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

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  8. Amen Littlejoe amen'd this post.
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    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    So, about ten weeks ago, Benny famously renounced "Prosperity Gospel" preaching.

    I don't keep up with the world of televangelism. Has he carried through with this? The first page of Google hits all seemed to be from September.

    I know his nephew Costi opposed his prosperity preaching, and published a book on the topic. I can't say I'm much more impressed with Costi than I am with Benny. He started a Facebook page just in time to launch the book, and AFAICT has not been back to it in about four months. And he seems to be allying himself with teachers that are *almost* as far off the road as Benny, but on the other side.
    For those of us even less au fait with these matters: what is the “other side” that Costi inclines to ? Thanks 😀

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    tWebber NorrinRadd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rushing Jaws View Post
    For those of us even less au fait with these matters: what is the “other side” that Costi inclines to ? Thanks 😀
    The things that came up in my exchange with Mossy.

    Pentecostals like Gordon Fee and Charismatics like Craig Keener have criticized "Word-Faith" and "Prosperity Gospel" excesses, as have the Assemblies of God. I identify aspirationally with Fee and Keener, and do not consider them out of the proper mainstream.

    By the "other side," I more refer to people like John MacArthur, who denounce Pentecostal and Charismatic beliefs and practices in toto, in aggressive and inflammatory terms, in addition to holding various other views I find incorrect. The fact that they "hold" the views is not as big a problem as the combative and condescending way they express them.
    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

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  11. Amen Rushing Jaws amen'd this post.
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    tWebber Rushing Jaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorrinRadd View Post
    The things that came up in my exchange with Mossy.

    Pentecostals like Gordon Fee and Charismatics like Craig Keener have criticized "Word-Faith" and "Prosperity Gospel" excesses, as have the Assemblies of God. I identify aspirationally with Fee and Keener, and do not consider them out of the proper mainstream.

    By the "other side," I more refer to people like John MacArthur, who denounce Pentecostal and Charismatic beliefs and practices in toto, in aggressive and inflammatory terms, in addition to holding various other views I find incorrect. The fact that they "hold" the views is not as big a problem as the combative and condescending way they express them.
    Thanks 😀😃 I like Johnnymac’s clarity - even if a milder delivery, now and then, might be no bad thing. Far too many churchmen woffle, and beat about the bush - with JM, one knows where one stands.

    I know almost nothing about Fee, but what little I’ve heard is good. I have a copy of “How To Read The Bible For All It’s Worth”, which he co-wrote with Douglas Stuart. The only theology that comes through is basic Evangelical Protestantism - and not so strongly as to make the book unattractive to those of us who are neither. If someone asked me for a straightforward, accessible, intelligent, clear introduction to the Bible for a reader who had no knowledge of it, I would recommend that book. It really is outstanding 😄

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