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Thread: The Joe Biden thread

  1. #541
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    I just don't understand where you're coming from on this
    I don't think you can.

    Are you dismissing Biden because you discount his track record? Because you think he is slipping mentally? Because you dislike how he treats women? Because you don't think we need an empathetic leader right now? Because he just gives you the Willies?
    I think he's a dinosaur. He's stuck in the past, and his mental faculties are not capable of upholding the pressures of the Office. That's my opinion. I believe, if he IS elected, he won't last long. He won't be able to handle the pressure, and will either crack, or cede the office to whoever his VP will be. Meanwhile, the country will be run by his handlers, not Joe, himself.

    What makes you think he is a *bad* choice?
    See above.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanD View Post
    Trump is unpopular with the left. That won't get Biden elected.
    Hillary Clinton would beg to differ.

    You want folks to be enthusiastic enough about a democrat running against Trump so that they DO vote. Otherwise, hating Trump, but not being confident or enthusiastic about his opponent means they just won't vote. That's obviously not going to prevent Trump from being reelected. This is just ONE reason why polls are unreliable, because even though a person polled might say they support a certain candidate over another doesn't mean they'll actually vote.
    That's true but that's why pollsters also ask people about how enthusiastic they are in their position. Also, I think there is plenty of reason to believe that Democrats are fired up.

    1) It's been made as clear as possible that abortion access is not guaranteed and that Roe will likely be overturned with another conservative on the SC. I can guarantee women are going to be fired up big time as a result (see 2018).
    2) Wrecked economy and the opportunity to vote for Obama's third term? I am sure the now unemployed are fired up about that.
    3) PoC are experiencing renewed racism egged on by Trump. I'm sure they are fired up to vote for a third Obama term, a possibly WoC VP, and a WoC SC Justice.
    4) Climate change is an issue which fires up the youth and it's obvious which candidate will work to address that.

    Plenty of reason to be excited to vote for a generic Democrat and Biden in particular.

  3. #543
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    Hillary Clinton would beg to differ.



    That's true but that's why pollsters also ask people about how enthusiastic they are in their position. Also, I think there is plenty of reason to believe that Democrats are fired up.

    1) It's been made as clear as possible that abortion access is not guaranteed and that Roe will likely be overturned with another conservative on the SC. I can guarantee women are going to be fired up big time as a result (see 2018).
    2) Wrecked economy and the opportunity to vote for Obama's third term? I am sure the now unemployed are fired up about that.
    3) PoC are experiencing renewed racism egged on by Trump. I'm sure they are fired up to vote for a third Obama term, a possibly WoC VP, and a WoC SC Justice.
    4) Climate change is an issue which fires up the youth and it's obvious which candidate will work to address that.

    Plenty of reason to be excited to vote for a generic Democrat and Biden in particular.
    I think you're overlooking the growing sense in our country that this whole pandemic thing has been used to try to control people in unreasonable manners --- like that crackpot psycho Democrat woman Governor in Michigan. These things tend to bring out the control freak in liberals.

    Entirely anecdotal, I know, but our police department is amazed at the traffic going through our county like WAY more than any Memorial Day weekend in memory. People are tired of this, and tired of the way "government" is.... what's that Democrat advice.... "never let a good crisis go to waste".
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  4. #544
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I don't think you can.
    That doesn't seem called for :).


    I think he's a dinosaur. He's stuck in the past, and his mental faculties are not capable of upholding the pressures of the Office. That's my opinion. I believe, if he IS elected, he won't last long. He won't be able to handle the pressure, and will either crack, or cede the office to whoever his VP will be. Meanwhile, the country will be run by his handlers, not Joe, himself.
    Maybe. But he has a track record and he *was* VP for 8 years. He will only serve one term (I still think he should resign after 2 years + 1 day). But *why* do you think he couldn't do the job? What specifically gives you that impression? Is it his apparent confusion in the video clips which go around? Is it his gaffes? Just your overall feeling?

  5. #545
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    That doesn't seem called for :).
    I didn't mean that in any way disrespectful at all... you and I haven't done battle, and I don't intend to. I just think you can't grasp what I'm thinking.

    Maybe. But he has a track record and he *was* VP for 8 years.
    He does. And that's wonderful, but, what's the saying? Being VP is like a warm bucket of ... um.... "spit".

    He will only serve one term (I still think he should resign after 2 years + 1 day).
    I don't think he'll make it that far, IF elected.

    But *why* do you think he couldn't do the job?
    Because he's not who he was.

    What specifically gives you that impression? Is it his apparent confusion in the video clips which go around? Is it his gaffes? Just your overall feeling?
    All of the above, and the nutty way he reacts to criticism - "let's go outside and I'll beat your...." He's a NUT. He wants to act like a TOUGH GUY, but when he's pressed into answering tough questions --- and the media has been GENTLE with him so far --- he falls all over himself stumbling and stuttering and mumbling....
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  6. #546
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I think you're overlooking the growing sense in our country that this whole pandemic thing has been used to try to control people in unreasonable manners --- like that crackpot psycho Democrat woman Governor in Michigan. These things tend to bring out the control freak in liberals.

    Entirely anecdotal, I know, but our police department is amazed at the traffic going through our county like WAY more than any Memorial Day weekend in memory. People are tired of this, and tired of the way "government" is.... what's that Democrat advice.... "never let a good crisis go to waste".
    I believe that there is quite a bit of that sentiment. We will see in two weeks whether things were overblown or not.

    Here is a quite interesting and terrifying graph. While coronavirus deaths are declining overall if you discount the northeast they are *barely* declining. And, discounting the northeast, the number of cases is *increasing*. That doesn't scream "open for business" to me.

    EYty_xyX0AIwp72.jpg
    Last edited by DivineOb; 05-23-2020 at 12:23 PM.

  7. #547
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    I believe that there is quite a bit of that sentiment. We will see in two weeks whether things were overblown or not.

    Here is a quite interesting and terrifying graph. While coronavirus deaths are declining if you discount the northeast they are *barely* declining. And, discounting the northeast, they are *increasing*. That doesn't scream "open for business" to me.

    EYty_xyX0AIwp72.jpg
    Understood, but there are also wide variances in regions. And, while not trying to defend it, people tend to accept certain risks as part of exercising freedoms - Americans are just wired that way.

    I'm thinking there's a growing backlash to all this shutdown, and - like I said - that nutter Michigan Governor unwittingly becomes the posterchild for "we're mad as hell and we're not gonna take this anymore!"
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  8. #548
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    Quote Originally Posted by DivineOb View Post
    Hillary Clinton would beg to differ.



    That's true but that's why pollsters also ask people about how enthusiastic they are in their position. Also, I think there is plenty of reason to believe that Democrats are fired up.

    1) It's been made as clear as possible that abortion access is not guaranteed and that Roe will likely be overturned with another conservative on the SC. I can guarantee women are going to be fired up big time as a result (see 2018).
    2) Wrecked economy and the opportunity to vote for Obama's third term? I am sure the now unemployed are fired up about that.
    3) PoC are experiencing renewed racism egged on by Trump. I'm sure they are fired up to vote for a third Obama term, a possibly WoC VP, and a WoC SC Justice.
    4) Climate change is an issue which fires up the youth and it's obvious which candidate will work to address that.

    Plenty of reason to be excited to vote for a generic Democrat and Biden in particular.
    Can you cite me specific polls where they actually ask folks about their enthusiasm? From the polls I've seen (or at least articles reporting on those polls), enthusiasm for Biden is waning.
    "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

  9. #549
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I didn't mean that in any way disrespectful at all... you and I haven't done battle, and I don't intend to. I just think you can't grasp what I'm thinking.



    He does. And that's wonderful, but, what's the saying? Being VP is like a warm bucket of ... um.... "spit".



    I don't think he'll make it that far, IF elected.



    Because he's not who he was.



    All of the above, and the nutty way he reacts to criticism - "let's go outside and I'll beat your...." He's a NUT. He wants to act like a TOUGH GUY, but when he's pressed into answering tough questions --- and the media has been GENTLE with him so far --- he falls all over himself stumbling and stuttering and mumbling....
    Ok, I understand your perspective I think. I agree, as I think would most, that Biden's best days are behind him and he's not who I would ideally choose to be president. I don't think he will crack like you say but I'd much rather just take another Obama term as would I think most.

    Let me clarify my perspective. The most important characteristic of any politician is that they win and I believe Biden has the best shot at winning based on the data in front of me (at best it could be claimed that he was even money with Sanders for a short while though that radically misstates things). He may not be the ideal person to be President but he might be the ideal person to run against Trump (e.g. third Obama term, direction of the country under Obama etc.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by seanD View Post
    Can you cite me specific polls where they actually ask folks about their enthusiasm? From the polls I've seen (or at least articles reporting on those polls), enthusiasm for Biden is waning.
    I was speaking for generally about enthusiasm for voting Democratic, not specifically enthusiasm for Biden. I am aware that people are less enthusiastic to vote for Biden than Trump's (smaller) base is to vote for him (that would almost be a requirement). I believe that will change both after Biden chooses his VP and as the election is transformed fully into a referendum on Trump. Also I think a lot of that polling on Biden was done still pretty close to the primary and there remained a lot of hurt feelings. I know in 2016 it took me a long time to become enthusiastic to vote for Clinton after Sanders lost.
    Last edited by DivineOb; 05-23-2020 at 01:44 PM.

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