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Thread: It's the Economy, Stupid!

  1. #21
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    His statement isn't false. The lions share of the recovery from the economic bubble occured under Obama.

    After that, the growth of the GDP has been pretty much the same.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/...es-since-1990/


    However the Dow Jones index have done rather better under Trump.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...r-donald-trump
    The stock market is not the economy. The Main Street versus Wall Street dynamic is often overlooked when discussing these matters. Part of the reason Wall Street did so well under Obama is because of the massive stimulus/slush fund he was handed early in his presidency, but while Wall Street investors were happy, those who lived on Main Street were struggling to find work and make ends meet.
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    tWebber firstfloor's Avatar
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    Concerning sovereign debt, the World Bank compares countries based on their total debt-to-gross domestic product ratio. It considers a country to be in trouble if that ratio is greater than 77%. The U.S. ratio is 104%.
    “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
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  3. #23
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firstfloor View Post
    Concerning sovereign debt, the World Bank compares countries based on their total debt-to-gross domestic product ratio. It considers a country to be in trouble if that ratio is greater than 77%. The U.S. ratio is 104%.
    I'm amazed that nobody in Congress - either house or either party - or the White House seems troubled by the massive debt. It used to be a major factor in campaigns.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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  5. #24
    Technology Staff Leonhard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    The stock market is not the economy. The Main Street versus Wall Street dynamic is often overlooked when discussing these matters. Part of the reason Wall Street did so well under Obama is because of the massive stimulus/slush fund he was handed early in his presidency, but while Wall Street investors were happy, those who lived on Main Street were struggling to find work and make ends meet.
    Yes, because there was an economic recession that started under Bush. Again, we see a recovery all the way through Obama's period, continuing into Trump's period. Again Trump seems to be doing good, and the US continues on a good path.


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    Technology Staff Leonhard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    I'm amazed that nobody in Congress - either house or either party - or the White House seems troubled by the massive debt. It used to be a major factor in campaigns.
    What I don't get is the flip conservative politicians did from criticizing Obama for it, to Newt Gingrich claiming "Debt doesn't matter".

  7. #26
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Yes, because there was an economic recession that started under Bush. Again, we see a recovery all the way through Obama's period, continuing into Trump's period. Again Trump seems to be doing good, and the US continues on a good path.
    Which is magnified by the fact that the gloom and doomers had predicted disaster. Obama had even said in 2016 that 3% growth was impossible, because there's a "new normal", and even (in 2010) the 9.x% unemployment rate was part of the "new normal".

    And while everybody seems so anxious to give Obama the credit, at the time (2010) he said, himself,
    "There are times when I thought that the economy would have gotten better by now," he said. "You know, one of the things I think you understand as president is you're held responsible for everything, but you don't always have control of everything, right?"
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  8. #27
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    What I don't get is the flip conservative politicians did from criticizing Obama for it, to Newt Gingrich claiming "Debt doesn't matter".
    Agreed - and a certain amount of debt is tolerable, of course, particularly when you can see light at the end of the tunnel --- but we seem to be on a spending spree on steroids, with Republicans wanting every bigger increases in defense spending, and getting it by caving into Democrats' spending on anything they want.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

  9. #28
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    The stock market is not the economy. The Main Street versus Wall Street dynamic is often overlooked when discussing these matters. Part of the reason Wall Street did so well under Obama is because of the massive stimulus/slush fund he was handed early in his presidency, but while Wall Street investors were happy, those who lived on Main Street were struggling to find work and make ends meet.
    Of course they were struggling, Obama inherited a near depression. Many people, millions, lost their jobs, their homes, and their savings, and then after 4 years of Obama, they turned around and elected Obama for a second term. He did this while bringing down the deficit and though the economy continued to do better in Trumps first year it's leveled off at the time he can take any credit at all. The deficit also grew under Trump as as is the usual case under republican administrations after all their whining about debt and deficits.

  10. #29
    Technology Staff Leonhard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Obama had even said in 2016 that 3% growth was impossible,
    Actually he said he feared that this was the case, not that it was. And he only said it once.

    And while everybody seems so anxious to give Obama the credit, at the time (2010) he said, himself,
    I'm not anxious, but the economy didn't flatline during Obama like is claimed. That simply isn't shown from the data.

  11. #30
    See, the Thing is... Cow Poke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Actually he said he feared that this was the case, not that it was. And he only said it once.
    I think there were a few more examples that were similar, but it's not worth belaboring the point. It appeared that the Democrats, in particular, were taking a rather pessimistic view of the future.

    I'm not anxious, but the economy didn't flatline during Obama like is claimed. That simply isn't shown from the data.
    My point is, as I said, that the doom and gloomers were predicting that the economy would come crashing down if Trump were elected. It obviously has not. Yet.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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