First they ban plastic, now paper

[Sparko]

I guess you have to start carrying your own to-go bags and coffee cups in San Francisco.

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Forget the plastic straws. California cafes are disposing of, well, disposable cups

A new cafe culture is brewing in the San Francisco area, where a growing number of coffee houses are banishing paper to-go cups and replacing them with everything from glass jars to rental mugs and BYO cup policies.

What started as a small trend among neighborhood cafes to reduce waste is gaining support from some big names in the city’s food and coffee world.

Celebrated chef Dominique Crenn, owner of the three-star Michelin restaurant Atelier Crenn, is opening a San Francisco cafe next year that will have no to-go bags or disposable coffee cups and will use no plastic. Customers who plan to sip and go at Boutique Crenn will be encouraged to bring their own coffee cups, says spokeswoman Kate Bittman.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...ps/2744534001/
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Yeah because giving people their coffee in glass jars to carry around the streets is such a great idea.

[Mountain Man]

Oh, good, because that's the worse of San Francisco's problems.

tl-horizontal_main.jpg

[Leonhard]

Oh, good, because that's the worse of San Francisco's problems.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]41742[/ATTACH]

You guys still thought that poop app was a real thing for months on end.

[Leonhard]

You guys still thought that poop app was a real thing for months on end.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/02/...ng-or-a-rumor/

Source: Mercury Times - San Francisco poop map: real thing or a rumor?

In November 2014, web developer Jennifer Wong won a hack week contest at her job with Human Wasteland, an interactive map that plotted locations of feces reported to San Francisco’s street cleaners. It got mentions from some local media — the Bold Italic called it “playful” — and that was that, for a while.

But around the end of 2016, it started getting coverage of a different sort, as politically conservative media used it in condemnation of San Francisco.

© Copyright Original Source

[Mountain Man]

You guys still thought that poop app was a real thing for months on end.

Yeah, because San Francisco's poop problem is disgustingly real...

(Nov 2019) There has been an increase in the number of complaints about feces in the streets of San Francisco lately, according to city data obtained by rental site RentHop.

RentHop found using public data from the city’s website where people can complain to the city about reports of human and animal waste that the city has received more than 25,000 complaints about fecal matter between January and November of this year.

https://www.breitbart.com/environmen...lem-worsening/

[simplicio]

I guess you have to start carrying your own to-go bags and coffee cups in San Francisco.

-------
Forget the plastic straws. California cafes are disposing of, well, disposable cups

A new cafe culture is brewing in the San Francisco area, where a growing number of coffee houses are banishing paper to-go cups and replacing them with everything from glass jars to rental mugs and BYO cup policies.

What started as a small trend among neighborhood cafes to reduce waste is gaining support from some big names in the city’s food and coffee world.

Celebrated chef Dominique Crenn, owner of the three-star Michelin restaurant Atelier Crenn, is opening a San Francisco cafe next year that will have no to-go bags or disposable coffee cups and will use no plastic. Customers who plan to sip and go at Boutique Crenn will be encouraged to bring their own coffee cups, says spokeswoman Kate Bittman.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...ps/2744534001/
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Yeah because giving people their coffee in glass jars to carry around the streets is such a great idea.

Seems the free market types are up in arms over these kinds of stories.

Just what is wrong with it?

[Leonhard]

Yeah, because San Francisco's poop problem is disgustingly real...

(Nov 2019) There has been an increase in the number of complaints about feces in the streets of San Francisco lately, according to city data obtained by rental site RentHop.

RentHop found using public data from the city’s website where people can complain to the city about reports of human and animal waste that the city has received more than 25,000 complaints about fecal matter between January and November of this year.

https://www.breitbart.com/environmen...lem-worsening/

They definitely have a huge homelessness problem.

[Leonhard]

Yeah because giving people their coffee in glass jars to carry around the streets is such a great idea.

I don't like these laws either Sparko, mostly because they're what we in Denmark call 'symbolic politics', its something that shows that "stuff is being done" without actually doing much.

I'd show up with a lead-copper mug.

[Sparko]

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/02/...ng-or-a-rumor/

Source: Mercury Times - San Francisco poop map: real thing or a rumor?

In November 2014, web developer Jennifer Wong won a hack week contest at her job with Human Wasteland, an interactive map that plotted locations of feces reported to San Francisco’s street cleaners. It got mentions from some local media — the Bold Italic called it “playful” — and that was that, for a while.

But around the end of 2016, it started getting coverage of a different sort, as politically conservative media used it in condemnation of San Francisco.

© Copyright Original Source

The article says the app is indeed real, just not an official government project.

[Sparko]

Seems the free market types are up in arms over these kinds of stories.

Just what is wrong with it?

First they ban plastic and replace it with paper which as I have said causes way more pollution than plastic (research paper mills) and now they are banning the paper they were promoting. It's ridiculous. They should never have banned plastic to begin with. California is full of touch-feely types who feel better about themselves by creating "causes" that in actuality do nothing, while ignoring actual problems, like the aforementioned poop in the streets and homelessness everywhere. But hey, they have banned paper and plastic. Yay!

[Sparko]

I don't like these laws either Sparko, mostly because they're what we in Denmark call 'symbolic politics', its something that shows that "stuff is being done" without actually doing much.

Exactly!

I'd show up with a lead-copper mug.

But yeah, people bringing their own dirty containers into coffee shops seems like a great way to spread disease. The barrister touches one germ-laden mug then handles another, and so on. And if they do use something like glass containers, how is that any better? Now you have glass shards all over the streets instead of paper cups.

[simplicio]

I don't like these laws either Sparko, mostly because they're what we in Denmark call 'symbolic politics', its something that shows that "stuff is being done" without actually doing much.

I'd show up with a lead-copper mug.

Not sure that this is empty symbolism. Municipal solid waste is a major problem in this country, and we generate more per capita than European countries. Landfills are an essential part of our infrastructure, even though it is different in form from sewage or electric lines.

And like much of this country's infrastructure, it is antiquated. But updating landfills mean more landfills (or stacking it higher) not replacing them like electric lines.

[mossrose]

Exactly!






But yeah, people bringing their own dirty containers into coffee shops seems like a great way to spread disease. The barrister touches one germ-laden mug then handles another, and so on. And if they do use something like glass containers, how is that any better? Now you have glass shards all over the streets instead of paper cups.

Even if the glass containers are only for in-store sitting and drinking, the cost of the product is going yo go up if they have to hire a dishwasher or install a dishwasher, etc.

There are a couple of places here that charge less for coffee if you bring your own mug. MelMak's grocer offers a discount, and so does 7-11. I can get any size coffee at 7-11 for .50 if I use my own mug. Of course 7-11 is only takeaway, nobody sits in there and drinks their beverage.

But, I predict the cost of the product will increase at these "environmentally cutting edge artsy-fartsy" places.

[Sparko]

Even if the glass containers are only for in-store sitting and drinking, the cost of the product is going yo go up if they have to hire a dishwasher or install a dishwasher, etc.

There are a couple of places here that charge less for coffee if you bring your own mug. MelMak's grocer offers a discount, and so does 7-11. I can get any size coffee at 7-11 for .50 if I use my own mug. Of course 7-11 is only takeaway, nobody sits in there and drinks their beverage.

But, I predict the cost of the product will increase at these "environmentally cutting edge artsy-fartsy" places.

Maybe California should ban coffee instead:

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Unfortunately, coffee is tied to a long history of colonialism and slavery,[4] and production of the crop remains a hotbed of exploitation and environmental degradation to this day.

To earn enough to survive, many parents pull their children from school to work on the coffee plantations.[5] Child labor is widespread in coffee cultivation. When the price of coffee rises, the incentive for struggling families to withdraw their children from school and send them to work increases

Many coffee workers are effectively enslaved through debt peonage, which is forced labor to repay debts. Landed elite in coffee-producing regions own large plantations where a permanent workforce is employed.[2] On these plantations, the only source for essential goods is often the estate shop run by the landowners, since workers are prevented from shopping elsewhere by their long hours of work, lack of transportation, or constraints on travelling out of the estate.[9] Since they earn less than minimum wage and must pay inflated prices at the estate shop, workers wind up with little or nothing to show for their long hours of hard physical labor—worse, they can become indebted to the plantation and are thus forced to work as payment on their debts. It is not unusual for families who are part of the permanent labor force on a plantation to work and live there for generations, sometimes being pushed into debt by the cost of renting land or interest on loans for emergency healthcare.[10] Forced labor aside, the conditions of work in coffee production are unjust and often illegal.
https://foodispower.org/our-food-choices/coffee/

[seer]

First they ban plastic and replace it with paper which as I have said causes way more pollution than plastic (research paper mills) and now they are banning the paper they were promoting. It's ridiculous. They should never have banned plastic to begin with. California is full of touch-feely types who feel better about themselves by creating "causes" that in actuality do nothing, while ignoring actual problems, like the aforementioned poop in the streets and homelessness everywhere. But hey, they have banned paper and plastic. Yay!

Ban toilet paper next?