Ethical naivete?

[Cow Poke]

Never said he did so if there is a lie, ironically, it is your own statement above.

Calm yourself, Charles... here's what you said...

Saying your actions should follow your words does not imply actions is always the most important. Neither does it say that it is ok to humiliate, talk in dehumanizing ways or even lie. I hope you did note that the example was not: "If one of you says to them, “Go back where you came from...”

What lie is it to which you refer? Or were you just spewing forth nonsense?

And do not EVER imply I lied unless you can back it up, kay?

[Charles]

Calm yourself, Charles... here's what you said...

What lie is it to which you refer? Or were you just spewing forth nonsense?

And do not EVER imply I lied unless you can back it up, kay?

I am completely calm and I can easily back it up. Both that I have never stated BtC lied and thus that your statement that I made this claim was actually a lie.

Here is what I wrote:

I see that Bill the Cat has gone to the level where he is willing to accept dehumanizing talk, talk boardering at racism, flat out lies, inhuman treatment of innocent children for something he defines as a higher moral ground.

His response to that particular part was:

Correct.

James 2:16
16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it?

I have thus only claimed that he accepted lies. Not that he himself lied. And he said I was correct in stating so and provided James 2:16 as his reason for his line of reasoning.

I then quoted that part and gave the following comment about the quote:

Saying your actions should follow your words does not imply actions is always the most important. Neither does it say that it is ok to humiliate, talk in dehumanizing ways or even lie. I hope you did note that the example was not: "If one of you says to them, “Go back where you came from...”

So, it was obviously my statements about how it should be interpreted and not a statement about what BtC had done.

So, to repeat, the only lie was your statement that I claimed BtC had lied.

[carpedm9587]

Moral impeccability os a requirement to be a Christian? Usually that argument comes from a Christian!

I have to ask, do atheist see any need for moral decency? Does one lose his atheist card for moral failings?

Interesting questions.

This atheist does see a need for moral decency.

In theism, morality is closely linked to the specific theos the religion in question centers on. It many cases, it is seen as arising from this being. In atheism, morality is not directly linked to the worldview. It is simply another "fact of the day" within a universe that exists without a god or gods. So, in a real sense, morality and atheism are largely independent of one another. Even if I had an atheist card, it's not clear that the card would be lost if I were not a morally decent person.

[Charles]

Interesting questions.

This atheist does see a need for moral decency.

In theism, morality is closely linked to the specific theos the religion in question centers on. It many cases, it is seen as arising from this being. In atheism, morality is not directly linked to the worldview. It is simply another "fact of the day" within a universe that exists without a god or gods. So, in a real sense, morality and atheism are largely independent of one another. Even if I had an atheist card, it's not clear that the card would be lost if I were not a morally decent person.

Great to see you again, Carpe.

[simplicio]

Interesting questions.

This atheist does see a need for moral decency.

In theism, morality is closely linked to the specific theos the religion in question centers on. It many cases, it is seen as arising from this being. In atheism, morality is not directly linked to the worldview. It is simply another "fact of the day" within a universe that exists without a god or gods. So, in a real sense, morality and atheism are largely independent of one another. Even if I had an atheist card, it's not clear that the card would be lost if I were not a morally decent person.

Not sure I am comfortable with your explanation about theism's role in morality. I think the underlying theology impacts the moral theology, not how adherents to religion accept or live out that morality. Other than theoretical discussions, I often wonder at the similarities across religious divides on moral questions once once the issue becomes immediate, real, and personal. (few atheists take divorce lightly, for example).

Becareful, you have quotes from two interesting Christians (Douglas and King). The danger is if some of them rub off on you, you will lose your atheist credentials!

[Mountain Man]

Not sure I am comfortable with your explanation about theism's role in morality. I think the underlying theology impacts the moral theology, not how adherents to religion accept or live out that morality. Other than theoretical discussions, I often wonder at the similarities across religious divides on moral questions once once the issue becomes immediate, real, and personal. (few atheists take divorce lightly, for example).

Becareful, you have quotes from two interesting Christians (Douglas and King). The danger is if some of them rub off on you, you will lose your atheist credentials!

Word of warning before you go too far down the rabbit hole: carpe is a moral relativist with a very malleable ethic.

[simplicio]

Word of warning before you go too far down the rabbit hole: carpe is a moral relativist with a very malleable ethic.

He may be a relativist, but an articulate one.

Before he and I go too far, I'll make sure he concedes that Catholics are smarter, better looking, and more humble than atheists.

[Cow Poke]

I have thus only claimed that he accepted lies. Not that he himself lied.

Thank you, sir - that's all I asked.

English is not my first language.

[Bill the Cat]

Saying your actions should follow your words does not imply actions is always the most important.

Of course it does. It is a greater good to DO GOOD things than SAY GOOD things. It's of course preferable to do and say both, but DOING good is the more important thing.

Neither does it say that it is ok to humiliate, talk in dehumanizing ways or even lie.

Never claimed it was ok. Just that there are weightier matters that tip the scale of morality.

I hope you did note that the example was not: "If one of you says to them, “Go back where you came from...”

Never claimed that was the example.

[Timothy]

Well, I bet it won't stop your judgmental little condemnations.

I expect better from Christians, especially Pastors, because I am a Christian.
But you go ahead and do whatever you want.

[Cow Poke]

I expect better from Christians, especially Pastors, because I am a Christian.
But you go ahead and do whatever you want.

Thank, you sir, for your kind permission to call out your petty little judgmental spirit and oppose your false accusations.

[Timothy]

Thank, you sir, for your kind permission to call out your petty little judgmental spirit and oppose your false accusations.

Whatever

[Cow Poke]

Whatever

Cool.