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Cogito ergo sum

Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!

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Morally Wrong Behavior vs. What the Civil Government Should Prohibit

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  • Originally posted by seer View Post
    Well He couldn't since His moral character is immutable.
    He couldn't? So, the moral laws of god are not free will choices of his. Is your god morally determined?

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    • Originally posted by JimL View Post
      He couldn't? So, the moral laws of god are not free will choices of his. Is your god morally determined?
      Bingo!
      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
        He couldn't? So, the moral laws of god are not free will choices of his. Is your god morally determined?
        just a footnote. We don't have a 'personal' god. God is Lord over all things.

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        • Originally posted by JimL View Post
          He couldn't? So, the moral laws of god are not free will choices of his. Is your god morally determined?
          They're free in the sense there are no outside factors that determine how the moral laws of God looks like. But they're still set in stone because the laws of God derive from His nature, and there is no possible existence where God's nature is different from His nature in the actual world.

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          • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
            They're free in the sense there are no outside factors that determine how the moral laws of God looks like. But they're still set in stone because the laws of God derive from His nature, and there is no possible existence where God's nature is different from His nature in the actual world.
            So, morality then, is independent of gods will?

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            • Originally posted by JimL View Post
              So, morality then, is independent of gods will?
              That's literally the exact opposite of what I said.

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              • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                That's literally the exact opposite of what I said.
                Then are you saying that morality is simply dependent on gods will?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                  Then are you saying that morality is simply dependent on gods will?
                  God's will is dependent on His nature, just as morality is. In other words, Gods will and morality are perfectly in sync.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                    God's will is dependent on His nature, just as morality is. In other words, Gods will and morality are perfectly in sync.
                    Tell me then, is rape wrong in and of itself whether god exists or not, or is it only wrong because god exists?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                      Tell me then, is rape wrong in and of itself whether god exists or not, or is it only wrong because god exists?
                      It is only wrong because God deems it so.
                      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by seer View Post
                        It is only wrong because God deems it so.
                        So, rape, theft and murder, are not wrongs in and of themselves?

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                        • Originally posted by seer View Post
                          It is only wrong because God deems it so.
                          It’s “wrong” because society deems it so and historically attributed it to God – which explains why “right and wrong” has changed so much over time.
                          “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

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                          • Originally posted by seer View Post
                            No Tass, you tied it into survival of the species. Do I really need to go back and find it?
                            No, I did not. I said that “treating women like chattel” undermines today’s social values.”

                            OK, so our present western values are no more valid or correct than values in the days when women were treated like chattel. Got it...
                            What is culturally valid or correct varies to a degree from culture to culture over time. For example, owning slaves and subjugating women was considered culturally correct for centuries by Christian societies. It was even justified by scripture. It is no longer; today it is considered wrong.

                            That has nothing to do with the Civil Rights acts nor did they reference it.
                            It has to do with the illegality of “state bans on same-sex marriage and on recognizing same-sex marriages duly performed in other jurisdictions are unconstitutional under the due process and equal protection clauses of the Fourteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution”. The intent of the Civil Rights Act is the same.

                            Again the specific part of the act that we are discussing only applies to interstate commerce, again: if I ran a fruit stand and grew my own fruit I could legally turn anyone away I wanted, since the Civil Rights Act is predicated on interstate commerce.
                            You could NOT legally turn anyone away on the basis of discrimination against their religion (e.g. Jewish or Muslim) or the color of their skin (e.g. black or brown) or because you disapproved of their marital status (e.g. interracial or homosexual). Does your deity really approve of such small-minded bigotry being labeled as “free exercise of religion”?
                            “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                              So, rape, theft and murder, are not wrongs in and of themselves?
                              Nope, not in a godless universe where moral relativism is the case.
                              Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                                It’s “wrong” because society deems it so and historically attributed it to God – which explains why “right and wrong” has changed so much over time.
                                Well things like rape murder and theft have been wrong all through Scripture, and through most cultures.
                                Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                                Comment

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