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Thread: RIP #MeToo

  1. #171
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by simplicio View Post
    "Sorta on her own"? You hinted at, but fell short of explicitly stating an important detail: the women will often need to find another church to worship after "outing" a pastor or Christian in an leadership position.

    Violation of the cultural norms, even if it involves in rejection of pedophilia within the church, or approaches to abuse, often results in shunning the whistle blower.
    Actually, believe it or not. The last SBC church I was at ended up right there, in intern was off the rails in abusive practices in the youth group and the pastors handled it very, very poorly, at first refusing to believe those telling them what was going on, then trying to sweep it under the rug.

    Not incidentally, they were big on piper too.
    Last edited by oxmixmudd; 02-08-2020 at 08:48 AM.
    He will reply, ĎTruly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  2. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    Actually, believe it or not. The last SBC church I was at ended up right there, in intern was off the rails in abusive practices in the youth group and the pastors handled it very, very poorly, at first refusing to believe those telling them what was going on, then trying to sweep it under the rug.
    I've been trying to deduce what religious background was.

    Most troubling is the pattern of poor responses by churches, even after the scandalously poor response by the Catholic Church. Even with the model of what not to do when confronted with a problem, churches did not have a plan or thought to follow any plan.

    Few churches are forthright in discussing it after the fact. One church was in Virginia (I think, it was so long ago and I did try to find the article again, but could not) did discuss what they did wrong (they passed on a predator child abuser to the next church) and the thought processes involved.

  3. #173
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
    Iíve known abused women and have helped a few out and conservative pastors are among those saying to get away. Even had one that that made it clear that he wouldnít keep abuse secret and would contact the police if told, by a women, that she was being abused. What do we know though? We disagree with the great Jim, so who should we believe? Our lying eyes and ears or the supreme moral arbitrator, Jim?
    One pastor I know, if he heard about something like this, would immediately get together a group of the strongest men in the church to go over and protect the woman while she packed and escort her to a place of safety.
    Last edited by Mountain Man; 02-08-2020 at 09:43 AM.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  4. #174
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    One pastor I know, if he heard about something like this, would immediately get together a group of the strongest men in the church to go over and protect the woman while she packed and escort her to a place of safety.
    I've heard about that taking place several times with at least one case where one of those accompanying the pastor being a deputy sheriff who was forced to arrest the soon to be ex-husband when he started threatening them.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
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  5. #175
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    I've heard about that taking place several times with at least one case where one of those accompanying the pastor being a deputy sheriff who was forced to arrest the soon to be ex-husband when he started threatening them.
    On the one hand, we have the stories of all the heroic individual Christians, on the other hand we have the image of women demanding change within the Christian world, and getting blowback!

    Where were all the heroic individuals and churches when it came to addressing it at some macro level? The women rallied, calling it "prevalence of abuse and enablement of abuse", such that the church needed to reform its culture.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/se...-women-n880216

  6. #176
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by simplicio View Post
    On the one hand, we have the stories of all the heroic individual Christians, on the other hand we have the image of women demanding change within the Christian world, and getting blowback!

    Where were all the heroic individuals and churches when it came to addressing it at some macro level? The women rallied, calling it "prevalence of abuse and enablement of abuse", such that the church needed to reform its culture.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/se...-women-n880216
    What mm and rogue are talking about is, in fact, a bit rare. In fact the only time I've ever heard something similar actually implemented was a paster friend talking about what their community (not sure if that was synonymous with church) used to do growing up in the mountains of NC when a man was abusing his wife, only I don't think what they did technically was legal and would not be possible in these times.

    Definitions of abuse would have been a bit different then too.
    Last edited by oxmixmudd; 02-08-2020 at 10:13 AM.
    He will reply, ĎTruly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  7. #177
    Evolution is God's ID rogue06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    What mm and rogue are talking about is, in fact, a bit rare. In fact the only time I've ever heard something similar actually implemented was a paster friend talking about what they used to do growing up in the mountains of NC when a man was abusing his wife, only I don't think what they did technically was legal and would not be possible in these times.
    Indeed it's a "bit rare" since thankfully most split-ups don't require such extraordinary measures.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization thatís not the argument." --Tassman

  8. #178
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    Indeed it's a "bit rare" since thankfully most split-ups don't require such extraordinary measures.
    Interesting interpretation of my post. The rarity I was talking about the overall attitude and willingness to deal with the problem in that fashion, not the frequency with which such measures would be required.
    Last edited by oxmixmudd; 02-08-2020 at 11:13 AM.
    He will reply, ĎTruly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

    "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets"

  9. #179
    tWebber Mountain Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    What mm and rogue are talking about is, in fact, a bit rare.
    Not in my experience. And apparently not according to the author of the essay you cited. You still haven't been able to account for the disconnect between "Conservative churches promote attitudes and policies that encourage the abuse of women" and "Those who regularly attend conservative churches are the least likely to be abusive because of regular exposure to balanced teaching".
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

  10. #180
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Not in my experience. And apparently not according to the author of the essay you cited. You still haven't been able to account for the disconnect between "Conservative churches promote attitudes and policies that encourage the abuse of women" and "Those who regularly attend conservative churches are the least likely to be abusive because of regular exposure to balanced teaching".
    The seeming paradox is similar to the points made by rogue and you about the churches policing and dealing with abuse, which takes on a different light with the phenomenon of women thinking that the culture of the church needing to change. Two conflicting narratives, but if only viewed through an either/or dichotomy one is left with the need to dismiss one as false and inaccurate.

    But the dichotomous lens is not the only way to look at it. Christianity derives its power (as a systematic theology, yes, the power is attributed to the divine godhead) through the resolution of paradox by keeping both seeming contradictions.

    If you are right then the women are wrong, the culture within the church does not need to change, and Paige Patterson remains a model for pastors to emulate.

  11. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.

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