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I'm A Bigot

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  • Originally posted by Zymologist View Post
    Well, he does live for unwitting irony....
    And exposes himself as being a first class bigot himself.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

    Comment


    • Originally posted by seer View Post
      Well Jim you were suggesting that because it was genetic it wasn't immoral or wrong. That does not follow.
      No, you were suggesting that genetics don't matter, that if one is genetically inclined to be a rapist then that doesn't make it right, which would be true, but genetics itself isn't a determining factor as to right and wrong.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
        No, you were suggesting that genetics don't matter, that if one is genetically inclined to be a rapist then that doesn't make it right, which would be true, but genetics itself isn't a determining factor as to right and wrong.
        Jim you were suggesting that Ronson wouldn't vote for a black because he wouldn't vote for a gay. I'm making the distinction between behavior and skin color. Skin color is not based on desire or behavior. It is neither psychological nor behavioral. Skin color is an immutable characteristic behavior is not. And even if homosexual inclination was immutable condition (which we don't know) acting on it is not. So your claim that Ronson was a racist is without merit.
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

        Comment


        • Originally posted by seer View Post
          Jim you were suggesting that Ronson wouldn't vote for a black because he wouldn't vote for a gay. I'm making the distinction between behavior and skin color. Skin color is not based on desire or behavior. It is neither psychological nor behavioral. Skin color is an immutable characteristic behavior is not. And even if homosexual inclination was immutable condition (which we don't know) acting on it is not. So your claim that Ronson was a racist is without merit.
          It also depends on how one defines "racism". I believe the left and right understand the term differently. Using the Merriam Webster definition (IMO) most people are not racist.

          racism.jpg

          But for black Americans who are profiled by police, Middle Easterners who are profiled by the NSA, or Hispanics who are profiled by ICE, it's a big problem. It's not that any of those groups are believed to be more criminal by authorities, but demographically there is a better likelihood the suspects they seek will be among those groups. I don't know the answer - except to acknowlegde that law enforcement is out of control and is often abusive to those groups.

          So anyway, voting for a minority is not a problem for me - it all depends on their platform. And after 40 years of voting I am pretty certain I have voted for blacks before for various offices. I certainly wouldn't vote for one simply because they are a minority and say "Oh, it's time we have a (blank) as president" (which I believe a lot of progressives do).

          Buttigieg is a different story. If he simply acknowledged his preferences and not displayed it, I would have less of a problem. This is all about optics. Progressives can claim ignorance and bigotry and intolerance all they wish, but I have an instinctive aversion to two grown men holding hands and playing on a swing together. I don't believe such a display is proper for the president of the US. I also don't think Trump's petty Twittering is proper either for that position, but that horse has already left the barn.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by seer View Post
            Jim you were suggesting that Ronson wouldn't vote for a black because he wouldn't vote for a gay. I'm making the distinction between behavior and skin color. Skin color is not based on desire or behavior. It is neither psychological nor behavioral. Skin color is an immutable characteristic behavior is not. And even if homosexual inclination was immutable condition (which we don't know) acting on it is not. So your claim that Ronson was a racist is without merit.
            I didn't claim that he was a racist, I just agreed with him that he is a bigot, a homophobe and added that he was therefore probably a racist as well.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by JimL View Post
              I didn't claim that he was a racist, I just agreed with him that he is a bigot, a homophobe and added that he was therefore probably a racist as well.
              Probably a racist Jim? A distinction without a difference. And how do you leap from having a problem with a particular behavior to looking down on people of a specific skin color? That makes no sense.
              Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Ronson View Post

                Buttigieg is a different story. If he simply acknowledged his preferences and not displayed it, I would have less of a problem. This is all about optics. Progressives can claim ignorance and bigotry and intolerance all they wish, but I have an instinctive aversion to two grown men holding hands and playing on a swing together. I don't believe such a display is proper for the president of the US. I also don't think Trump's petty Twittering is proper either for that position, but that horse has already left the barn.
                Right, I know a gay guy who is an asst. pastor. He is celibate and doesn't go around announcing his preference. That seems fine to me.
                Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Oh, and he was black, which appealed to progressive allies. They gave him a Peace Prize for doing nothing more than being black - and then he ended up fomenting lots of chaos in the Middle East (some peaceful guy).
                  Originally posted by Juvenal View Post
                  So yeah, it seems you are a bigot, and apparently a bigot with your own reality.
                  I came back to this conversation because our friend Ronson continues to make references to it.

                  So that was triggering. Noted.


                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Sheltered life.
                  Originally posted by Juvenal View Post
                  I've traveled four continents speaking to folks in seven languages. Howzbout you, sabatete?
                  And it preceded the interchange I thought was more relevant. Also noted.


                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Progressives/leftists like to shut people down with negative labels, because they have difficulty defending their position.
                  In point of fact, I'm neither of those. I'm a moderate, probably best described as a pre-Reagan Republican.

                  The only label I've applied to you ... other than the one you gave yourself ... is "sabatete," which is anything but negative.


                  Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                  IIRC, Ronson lived in England for a while. Not sure why that's stuck in my head.
                  I'll bear that in mind.

                  Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                  I OTOH have never left Pennsyltucky for more than a few days at a time. I've been as far south as Virginia Tech, and as far north as the Canadian side of Niagara Falls. I have cousins who are avid travelers and love going to Europe. Nothing they ever reported about their travels ever appealed to me.
                  That qualifies as Appalachia, and anecdotally confirms my earlier characterization: Appalachians don't get out much.

                  If friend NorrinRadd found tales from Europe unappealing, imagine what he'd think of places I've been where diseases are endemic and food is scarce and gasoline is scarcer and traveling to the next village takes days under skies turned orange from the dust blowing up from the Sahara during the dry season, and no one travels when it's wet.

                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  And Wales. It was for book research.

                  I have no interest in returning to Europe either. I am quite content with the US.
                  Pampered life.

                  I love the US, but it's not enough for me. Like most West Africans, my Senegalese friends are much more comfortable in French, so please overlook the occasional breaks from standard English.
                  Hopefully, one day you'll come back to visit us; we'll be delighted to have you in senegal. let us know when you'll have Opportunity to do so.

                  We moved to our new house much bigger than the one you knew, and and we have enough room and a lovely secondary house on the beach side, 30 minutes from dakar. you'll definitely love it.

                  That's email from three days ago. I haven't seen him in years, and I haven't met his daughter yet, either. Obviously, it's past time for another visit.


                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Exactly. Thank you. My claiming Obama received his prize for being black is demeaning? Saying he got it for "not being Bush" is far more demeaning, IMO.
                  It's not demeaning, because "No, you."

                  I understand the rhetorical value of the tu quoque, but even the most well-phrased fallacy will never qualify as an argument.

                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  I am not diminishing the prize. In fact, if Obama received the prize primarily because he was the first black US president, then he has full definitive claim to it. If it is diminished at all it is because it was bestowed for "not being Bush", which nearly the entire planet can claim. But aside from all the "nod-nod-wink-wink" asides, he did receive it for being the first black US president. Otherwise he should return it.
                  So ...
                  They gave him a Peace Prize for doing nothing more than being black ...

                  v.
                  I am not diminishing the prize.

                  Whenever y'all finish that argument with yourself, be sure to let us know who won.


                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Well, if Google doesn't support my assertion then I must be wrong. Google is never wrong. I mean, it's not like they use filters or anything.
                  And its not like I wasn't googling to see if I'd missed something. You had no issues with googling up the Heritage site, so I'd imagine you tried again on this one. From the abrupt shift to conspiracy thinking, I'd imagine it didn't pan out for you any better. Faced with evidence that you were wrong, you chose to believe the truth you held dear was being hidden from you.

                  You might want to take note of that.

                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  A lot of the reason appears to have been the simple fact that he wasn't Bush.
                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  Again, that's their claim, which makes no sense. Odds are that anyone who took office after Bush retired would not be Bush.

                  But if they actually convinced themselves that that's really why they were awarding him the prize, then they are bigger fools than I thought.
                  You write in complete sentences, which is more than I can say for my students, and I'm willing to engage with them. But I simply don't have time to engage with your conspiracy theories.

                  In Miami, I teach a lot of African-Americans, and some do poorly, and blame it on racism, and vocalize that. Once, in a direct accusation in conference with the African-American assistant to the chair I'd imagine she expected would prove sympathetic. In the interest of disengagement, neither of us pointed out that her granddaughter has bounced on my knee. We're friends.

                  Even so, the accusation stung.

                  So I'm sympathetic.

                  But you can't call out Obama's race as the reason he was given a Peace Prize, and provide no evidence, and dismiss contrary explanations ranging from moderates such as myself to right-wing hyperpartisans without expecting folks to note the disparity and come to antipathetic conclusions.

                  Unless rouge is a progressive/leftist now, too. He probably picked that up from Glenn Morton.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Dimbulb View Post
                    After there was a right-wing terrorist attack against Muslims in New Zealand done by a visiting foreigner, our Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern's compassionate response toward the Muslim victims seems to have won her a lot of praise from the global Muslim world. She put on a hijab and went and hugged the victim's families as well as helped them financially.
                    That's like putting on a Klan hood and hugging victims of racial violence.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                      I admit it. I could never vote for this guy - based purely on optics.

                      [ATTACH=CONFIG]42606[/ATTACH]
                      The alternatives are far more repulsive.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                        The alternatives are far more repulsive.
                        What alternatives?
                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                          Trump will save us
                          New religion of salvation?
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Juvenal View Post
                            I came back to this conversation because our friend Ronson continues to make references to it.

                            So that was triggering. Noted.
                            I am only reminded of it when I see your screen name, as the poster who made a false assumption and then started a lecture based on that.

                            And it preceded the interchange I thought was more relevant. Also noted.

                            In point of fact, I'm neither of those. I'm a moderate, probably best described as a pre-Reagan Republican.

                            The only label I've applied to you ... other than the one you gave yourself ... is "sabatete," which is anything but negative.
                            The exchange you're referring to was the annoying part. You threw a label at me that is obviously meaningless to 99999999% of the world. I chose to ignore it because I expected you wanted to use it as a launching pad into some self-serving diatribe about how worldy you are. But you did so anyway. You know what is impressive? Modest confidence, instead of clumsy flag waving.

                            Pampered life.

                            I love the US, but it's not enough for me. Like most West Africans, my Senegalese friends are much more comfortable in French, so please overlook the occasional breaks from standard English.

                            Hopefully, one day you'll come back to visit us; we'll be delighted to have you in senegal. let us know when you'll have Opportunity to do so.

                            We moved to our new house much bigger than the one you knew, and and we have enough room and a lovely secondary house on the beach side, 30 minutes from dakar. you'll definitely love it.

                            That's email from three days ago. I haven't seen him in years, and I haven't met his daughter yet, either. Obviously, it's past time for another visit.

                            It's not demeaning, because "No, you."

                            I understand the rhetorical value of the tu quoque, but even the most well-phrased fallacy will never qualify as an argument.
                            You'd have to pull this all together for me to follow you. I am responding to a fragmented post.

                            They gave him a Peace Prize for doing nothing more than being black ...

                            v.

                            I am not diminishing the prize.

                            Whenever y'all finish that argument with yourself, be sure to let us know who won.
                            The first part was overemphasized.

                            And its not like I wasn't googling to see if I'd missed something. You had no issues with googling up the Heritage site, so I'd imagine you tried again on this one. From the abrupt shift to conspiracy thinking, I'd imagine it didn't pan out for you any better. Faced with evidence that you were wrong, you chose to believe the truth you held dear was being hidden from you.
                            I didn't find as much evidence as I thought I would. But it doesn't matter, common sense isn't found through a Google search. There was no "peace" to be referred to in Obama's "peace prize", which means he received it for something else. You say it was for "not being Bush". I don't recall the world hating or despising GWB so much that anyone with a different license plate should get a prize. His father started a war with Saddam Hussein too, and Bill Clinton didn't get a prize for "not being Bush Sr.".

                            Obama was the first black US president and that made a huge impression on globalists, coming from the US that was late to abolish slavery and only recently secured civil rights for black Americans. I get it. And Obama didn't get to be the first black president due to Affirmative Action, but was elected by a majority. I get it. But if you want to say he got it for "not being Bush" then the prize isn't worth much. In fact, it's stupid.

                            You write in complete sentences, which is more than I can say for my students, and I'm willing to engage with them. But I simply don't have time to engage with your conspiracy theories.
                            First, there is no "conspiracy" being proposed here. Secondly, if you don't have time to "engage" me on this, then why did you resurrect this old thread to "engage" me on this? Whenever y'all resolve that inconsistency with yourself, be sure to let me know who won.

                            In Miami, I teach a lot of African-Americans, and some do poorly, and blame it on racism, and vocalize that. Once, in a direct accusation in conference with the African-American assistant to the chair I'd imagine she expected would prove sympathetic. In the interest of disengagement, neither of us pointed out that her granddaughter has bounced on my knee. We're friends.

                            Even so, the accusation stung.

                            So I'm sympathetic.

                            But you can't call out Obama's race as the reason he was given a Peace Prize, and provide no evidence, and dismiss contrary explanations ranging from moderates such as myself to right-wing hyperpartisans without expecting folks to note the disparity and come to antipathetic conclusions.
                            Point taken. However, the "contrary explanations" make no sense.

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