Richard Rohr

[Christian3]

The church today, aside from a few that stay with the word of God as their final authority, is so busy trying to get butts in the pews that they have resorted to marketing themselves. And in doing so, they fall prey to heretical books and false teachers because it's easier to do talking points from somebody's book than to actually open the truth's of God from scripture.

We actually watched this video this morning that speaks a great deal to this issue.

It's very enlightening.

Thank you.

[Christian3]

People want to be Nice. They don't want to talk about sin, and they don't want to say that Christ is the only Way.

Yeah, I get a lot of "I just can't believe that Jesus is the only way to God."

"What about all of good people? Why would God send good people to hell just because they don't believe in Jesus?"

[mossrose]

Yeah, I get a lot of "I just can't believe that Jesus is the only way to God."

"What about all of good people? Why would God send good people to hell just because they don't believe in Jesus?"

Can I ask you, with the greatest respect, and sincerity, why are you still there?

[Christian3]

Can I ask you, with the greatest respect, and sincerity, why are you still there?

Good question. I'm still there because I think it might be good for these people to hear what I have to say with the hope that I can make a difference in their position. With God's help maybe I can.

[Leonhard]

As a Catholic I'd like to say that he's quite heretical.

[mossrose]

Good question. I'm still there because I think it might be good for these people to hear what I have to say with the hope that I can make a difference in their position. With God's help maybe I can.

And I get that, and agree that an attempt should be made to help them understand why they shouldn't be following the heretical teachers they are. Be aware that those that are not taught the deep theological things of God are unlikely to want to change, especially if the pastor is part of the problem, because they just don't have enough discernment to to recognize error. It appears that you are discerning, though!

But, again with the greatest respect, remember Jesus words to His disciples, when he sent them out, that if people will not listen, they are to shake the dust from their feet.

We have actually gone through an experience where we tried to show the error of what was going on, and no one was interested. There was always some rationalization that they gave that prevented them from even looking at the evidence we had given them. We had to leave.

So, I pray God's blessing upon you and that you will be successful in your efforts.

[Christian3]

And I get that, and agree that an attempt should be made to help them understand why they shouldn't be following the heretical teachers they are. Be aware that those that are not taught the deep theological things of God are unlikely to want to change, especially if the pastor is part of the problem, because they just don't have enough discernment to to recognize error. It appears that you are discerning, though!

But, again with the greatest respect, remember Jesus words to His disciples, when he sent them out, that if people will not listen, they are to shake the dust from their feet.

We have actually gone through an experience where we tried to show the error of what was going on, and no one was interested. There was always some rationalization that they gave that prevented them from even looking at the evidence we had given them. We had to leave.

So, I pray God's blessing upon you and that you will be successful in your efforts.

Thank you for the prayer and the hug.

[Christian3]

The church today, aside from a few that stay with the word of God as their final authority, is so busy trying to get butts in the pews that they have resorted to marketing themselves. And in doing so, they fall prey to heretical books and false teachers because it's easier to do talking points from somebody's book than to actually open the truth's of God from scripture.

We actually watched this video this morning that speaks a great deal to this issue.

It's very enlightening.

I listened to it once, but need to do it again. It made me sad.

Could it be that there are some Christians who think they are Christians but are really not?

[mossrose]

I listened to it once, but need to do it again. It made me sad.

Could it be that there are some Christians who think they are Christians but are really not?

It is very sad that this is going on in our churches, and yes, there are those who think they are Christians and they are not.

I would like to recommend that you listen to all of the messages included in the Truth Matters Conference held last fall at Grace Community Church. They are all very good. You will find the page here,

https://www.gty.org/library/resource...te/2?year=2019

If you scroll down just a bit you will see the first one, Telling the Truth in a Post Truth World. There are several messages, and they all have TM- and then the number in the order which they were given.

We are watching them now, but have only just finished the one I linked to by Mike Riccardi.

[demi-conservative]

Yeah, I get a lot of "I just can't believe that Jesus is the only way to God."

"What about all of good people? Why would God send good people to hell just because they don't believe in Jesus?"

Well, that 'church' is dead.

[Christian3]

My Pastor attending Bible Study last Thursday and explained the document I cited.

He probably talked for about 45 minutes, but didn't pause for questions and he should have.

He said he was 100% At-one-ment and Atonement.

He said that for some Christians the concept of atonement did not work for them. The idea that God would sacrifice His son for humanity did not match their concept that everything God made was good. At-one-ment was about having a relationship with God.

He rolled his eyes that Jesus was the only way to the Father.

[mossrose]

My Pastor attending Bible Study last Thursday and explained the document I cited.

He probably talked for about 45 minutes, but didn't pause for questions and he should have.

He said he was 100% At-one-ment and Atonement.

He said that for some Christians the concept of atonement did not work for them. The idea that God would sacrifice His son for humanity did not match their concept that everything God made was good. At-one-ment was about having a relationship with God.

He rolled his eyes that Jesus was the only way to the Father.

Your last sentence says it all. Friend, you are sitting under heretical teaching and as I mentioned before, it is unlikely that things will change if he isn't even willing to allow questions about it.

[Christian3]

Your last sentence says it all. Friend, you are sitting under heretical teaching and as I mentioned before, it is unlikely that things will change if he isn't even willing to allow questions about it.

Yes, and it is very sad; there are a lot of good people in that church. AND, he is aware of some of our questions that came after he talk because they are emailed to him and so far he is not responding to them. I'll give him a little more time.

Thanks for your support.

[mossrose]

Yes, and it is very sad; there are a lot of good people in that church. AND, he is aware of some of our questions that came after he talk because they are emailed to him and so far he is not responding to them. I'll give him a little more time.

Thanks for your support.

Continuing to pray.

[Rushing Jaws]

This is the view associated in Catholic theology with the name of John Duns Scotus - info here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duns_Scotus

The Scotist understanding of the Incarnation is part of mainstream Catholic theology. http://franciscans.beimler.org/Incar...rituality.html

Scotism & Scotists: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13610b.htm

Blessed John Duns Scotus: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05194a.htm

That last article includes a survey of his ideas.

See also: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/duns-scotus/

Scotus did not say the Atonement was not necessary.