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  • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
    but you are, as usual, only telling half the story. You leave out the shenanigans of the republicans and emphasize (likely in a partially distorted form) what democrats are doing.

    AGAIN - this is not a partisan thing. And this sort of partisan bickering is insane. I'll grant you that if the democrats are trying to pork it up to feed their own special interests, that is bad. But what about the republicans doing the exact same thing? Isn't that bad too?

    And given in a time like this when selfish, greedy, leaders on both sides are still playing games, how exactly does that support the idea powerful businessmen - that are made of the same stuff congressmen and senators are - can by 'trusted' to do the right thing with the money? That is IDIOTIC. Many of them will NOT do the right thing. Some of them will - my hat is off to those in corporate leadership with a conscience. But the incidence of psychopathy and narcissism is MUCH higher in CEO's than the general population.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycho..._the_workplace

    Source: above

    A 2011 study of Australian white-collar managers found that 5.76 percent could be classed as psychopathic and another 10.42 percent dysfunctional with psychopathic characteristics.

    © Copyright Original Source



    As compared to 1% for the general population.

    --

    And without safe-guards, they will do whatever the heck they want - whatever benefits them the most. It is very important this much DEPT incurred for the sake of those hundreds of thousands or million that will die without flattening the curve must not be squandered.


    this is just what it it is. And only fools believe otherwise.
    Where there is a vast amount of money at play, corruption will inevitably follow. Appropriate safeguards to minimize the damage of the gluttonous are appropriate and should be explored. It is inevitable that each side will push for things they know won't fly, giving them things to sacrifice in the debate/discussion/negotiation. We can only hope that partisanship ha snot so deeply rooted itself in our leadership that they will cease to be able to have those negotiations and stall altogether.

    At the end of the day, however, the steps taken to bolster the economy are secondary to me, so if they need a week to sort it out and come up with a solid approach, I can live with my retirement nest egg shrinking a bit more. It's only money and there are more important things than money. What should NOT be postponed are actions to address the health epidemic itself. Trump's recent push to end social distancing and send people back to work, in the face of the scientific evidence and numbers, is more than a little scary. I further fear that Fauci is about to be sacrificed, and he has been the consistent, straightforward, voice of the science throughout this. But he is publicly contradicting Trump, and I predict that will not be tolerated much longer.
    The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

    I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

    Comment


    • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
      Sorry Jim but even Schumer admitted that they had pretty much worked out a bipartisan deal saying "We’re having good bipartisan agreements" and that "to my delight and surprise there has been a great deal of bipartisan cooperation."

      But Pelosi went to him and got him to go along with her plan to hold America hostage. Effectively they decided to shoot out the tires on the truck that was going to try put out the fire for their own personal gain.

      Now they're trying to spin what they've done to us as being for our good. [ATTACH=CONFIG]43489[/ATTACH]
      I doubt very much that your characterization of this is reality. It is just too much in line with your biased hatred of certain democrats to be reality. I gave Trump credit for pointing out we don't want the disease to be worse than the cure. That is a real concern. We can't ignore that. But until you reach the point you can even notice that in my post and discuss both sides of what is happening with honesty and objectivity, you are just as much a part of the problem as you believe Pelosi to be.

      It is this sort of petty bickering in a time like this that will destroy us. I hope you wake up to it before it's destruction is complete.
      Last edited by oxmixmudd; 03-24-2020, 11:20 AM.
      My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

      If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

      This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

      Comment


      • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
        I doubt very much that your characterization of this is reality. It is just too much in line with your biased hatred of certain democrats to be reality. I gave Trump credit for pointing out we don't want the disease to be worse than the cure. That is a real concern. We can't ignore that. But until you reach the point you can even notice that in my post and discuss both sides of what is happening with honesty and objectivity, you are just as much a part of the problem as you believe Pelosi to be.

        It is this sort of petty bickering in a time like this that will destroy us. I hope you wake up to it before it's destruction is complete.
        Then show what I've gone rather than cover your ears and close your eyes and repeat "this just can't be right because I don't like" it over and over like some mantra.

        I'm always still in trouble again

        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

        Comment


        • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
          Considering there is a presently unknown number of people who have it and show no symptoms that means the fatality rate is lower than we thought
          Which is what certain experts have been saying all along, but that didn't fit the liberal "Let's hype the fear factor in order to hurt President Trump!" narrative, so it has been downplayed to a great extent.
          Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
          Than a fool in the eyes of God


          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

          Comment


          • Originally posted by carpedm9587 View Post
            I've never agreed with such sweeping commentaries. Some Democrats, I'm sure, behave as you describe. Most of the Democrats I know do not. Likewise, some of the Republicans I've met are all about money and the economy and everything else takes second place - but most are not. Caricatures seldom capture the truth.
            Just answer a simple question:

            Which party, in general, is trying to use this situation to benefit themselves politically, and which party, in general, is trying to solve the problem?

            And please dispense with your usual "They're all equally to blame!" wishy-washy nonsense.
            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
            Than a fool in the eyes of God


            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

            Comment


            • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
              I doubt very much that your characterization of this is reality. It is just too much in line with your biased hatred of certain democrats to be reality. I gave Trump credit for pointing out we don't want the disease to be worse than the cure. That is a real concern. We can't ignore that. But until you reach the point you can even notice that in my post and discuss both sides of what is happening with honesty and objectivity, you are just as much a part of the problem as you believe Pelosi to be.

              It is this sort of petty bickering in a time like this that will destroy us. I hope you wake up to it before it's destruction is complete.
              Are you kidding Jim? The Dems are loading this bill with things that have NOTHING to do with this present crisis. That is a fact.
              Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

              Comment


              • Originally posted by seer View Post
                Are you kidding Jim? The Dems are loading this bill with things that have NOTHING to do with this present crisis. That is a fact.
                I found it rich that he objects to this since he claims that

                It is just too much in line with your biased hatred of certain democrats to be reality


                while latching onto any anti-Trump rumor with the tenacity of a rabid pitbull, refusing to let go even when it has been repeatedly proven to be without basis (can you say collusion delusion?)

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                  Just answer a simple question:

                  Which party, in general, is trying to use this situation to benefit themselves politically, and which party, in general, is trying to solve the problem?

                  And please dispense with your usual "They're all equally to blame!" wishy-washy nonsense.
                  smiley pick-me.gif The party with the philosophy of "Never let a crisis go to waste"?

                  I'm always still in trouble again

                  "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                  "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                  "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                    [ATTACH=CONFIG]43490[/ATTACH] The party with the philosophy of "Never let a crisis go to waste"?
                    I'll hold up the statements of my own state's Republican Governor who has not been critical of Trump but who is mostly following Cuomo's lead procedurally simply because it's the right response so far:

                    Source: Maryland Governor Hogan

                    Hogan on CNN Tuesday morning described the fight in Washington, in which the fundamental structure of the government's response to potentially the most damaging economic crisis since the Great Depression is in the balance, as "partisan bickering."

                    "We've got to get the Republicans and Democrats working together to get this done for the American people," Hogan said. "But in the meantime, in the states, we're taking our own actions.

                    © Copyright Original Source

                    My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                    If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                    This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      Which is what certain experts have been saying all along, but that didn't fit the liberal "Let's hype the fear factor in order to hurt President Trump!" narrative, so it has been downplayed to a great extent.
                      I guess we're back to the "chicken little" narrative. Oh well. For a short while, Trump was listening to his scientific advisers, and his base appeared to drop the theme. Now he's apparently reconsidering and his base is apparently falling right in line.
                      The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                      I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                      Comment


                      • I didn't realize the testing for corona was so gnarly and painful.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                          Just answer a simple question:

                          Which party, in general, is trying to use this situation to benefit themselves politically, and which party, in general, is trying to solve the problem?

                          And please dispense with your usual "They're all equally to blame!" wishy-washy nonsense.
                          As far as I can tell, there are elements of both in both parties.

                          Sorry if that doesn't satisfy your desire for a black/white answer. I'm hoping that sane minds will prevail and they will arrive at a compromise solution soon. As far as I know, however, the emergency things needed to address the medical-related issues were in Phase I and Phase II and Trump's start towards invoking the Defense Production Act and Declaring a national emergency. Phase III is mostly about the economy, and I am happy for them to take a bit of time and work out something that both provides money and protects against it becoming another shoveling of money to the more wealthy. That is what happened with the 2008/2009 bailout, and what happened with the 2018 tax cut. I'm sick of policies that benefit the wealthy disproportionate to the everyday working person. Borrowing more money from the next two generations to fatten 2020 tycoons is not my preference.

                          ETA: I cannot say I have read the entire 1400 page Democratic bill, but here is a comparison of the bill with the Republican bill. I am not seeing anything here I have a problem with.
                          Last edited by carpedm9587; 03-24-2020, 12:38 PM.
                          The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                          I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            I found it rich that he objects to this since he claims that

                            It is just too much in line with your biased hatred of certain democrats to be reality


                            while latching onto any anti-Trump rumor with the tenacity of a rabid pitbull, refusing to let go even when it has been repeatedly proven to be without basis (can you say collusion delusion?)
                            Continuing to play the rabid partisan game is not in our best interests. I am not working in that mode right now. We need to work together right now, we can sort out our differences later.
                            My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism. James 2:1

                            If anyone thinks himself to be religious, and yet does not  bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this man’s religion is worthless James 1:26

                            This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; James 1:19

                            Comment


                            • The above defense of Rand Paul choosing to test out of caution "because he's powerful" now fails, because Paul has chosen not even to self-quarantine in the first place. So what was even the point? (Edit: I had in fact misunderstood.)
                              Last edited by KingsGambit; 03-24-2020, 01:00 PM.
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
                                Continuing to play the rabid partisan game is not in our best interests. I am not working in that mode right now. We need to work together right now, we can sort out our differences later.
                                I have to admit to significant doubts that many can be pulled away from their extreme partisanship. Note that anyone who attempts to see the merits of both sides is painted as mouthing "wishy-washy nonsense." The only acceptable response for many is one that firmly takes one side and denounces the other.

                                I don't think even this virus will end that.
                                The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy...returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King

                                I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong. Frederick Douglas

                                Comment

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