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Thread: Does Socialism align with Scripture?

  1. #201
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    I notice Starlight is still not able to deal with my 2 posts here and here on his lack of contextual reading and then twisting the bible to say what he wants it to say. I guess he is conceding that he does not know the bible as well has he pretends to and is not taking what it says seriously. He is also admitting that he has falsely accused the conservatives who do take the bible seriously of doing to the bible what he does, read into it what he wants to instead of taking out of it what it says.

  2. #202
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
    Define ‘basic necessities’.
    Shelter, food, healthcare and education.

    Living in a privileged nation like we do, these are things I would consider basic necessities that everyone should be entitled to.

    We shouldn’t have people starving because they have no money for food or unnecessarily in pain or sick because they can’t afford to see a doctor or living on the streets because they have no place to go or being unable to acquire skills or the knowledge to work where they want.

  3. #203
    What's that? lilpixieofterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Watermelon View Post
    Shelter, food, healthcare and education.

    Living in a privileged nation like we do, these are things I would consider basic necessities that everyone should be entitled to.

    We shouldn’t have people starving because they have no money for food or unnecessarily in pain or sick because they can’t afford to see a doctor or living on the streets because they have no place to go or being unable to acquire skills or the knowledge to work where they want.
    So does the government need to pay my house payment, for me?

    FYI, Americans are not starving.
    "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
    GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

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    Technology Staff Leonhard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
    So does the government need to pay my house payment, for me?
    Are you unable to provide lodging for yourself?

    FYI, Americans are not starving.
    Does every American have a place to live, three meals a day, clothing and internet access?

  5. #205
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
    So does the government need to pay my house payment, for me?
    Not unless you can’t afford your basic necessities.

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    What's that? lilpixieofterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonhard View Post
    Are you unable to provide lodging for yourself?
    Is housing a right?

    Does every American have a place to live, three meals a day, clothing and internet access?
    And where does that burden sit?
    "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
    GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

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    What's that? lilpixieofterror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Watermelon View Post
    Not unless you can’t afford your basic necessities.
    Why? Housing is a right, correct?
    "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
    GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogue06 View Post
    Charities are usually far more efficient at helping folks than a bloated bureaucracy is. Hence, less taxes and more charities. This will give the left a chance to put their money where their mouths are. Or are they only good at helping with other people's money and too stingy to use their own?
    How effective are charities? Or to be more direct, how effectiveare Christian charities?

    I argue that Christian charities are very efficient, effective on a micro scale (sometimes, there are many examples inefficient Christian charities), however, they are not really effective on broad scale, national level. They are restricted by their revenues, how willing individuals are to give for their cause. That is why many have sought to have government tax dollars be administered by the Christian charity.

    Private charity can coexist with public charity, programs run on taxpayer dollars. Yes, people may not check on their neighbors when they should, but I doubt that is because the central government takes on charitable functions.

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    tWebber
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    The important thing about the right to housing is that any person refusing that right will be found guilty of a crime and put in jail.

  10. #210
    tWebber Starlight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simplicio View Post
    How effective are charities?
    There's a whole movement called effective altruism that's interested in measuring precisely this, and optimizing how effective charity is. Because, of course, utilitarians are quite interested in maximizing the good they do.

    Which reminds me, I really ought to read more of the writings of the philosophers who started that movement. What I've read so far by Peter Singer has been quite good. And I don't think I've read anything yet by Toby Ord or William MacAskill. I find moral philosophy to be one of the few sub-topics in philosophy where living philosophers tend to be far more interesting to read than historical philosophers.

    I argue that Christian charities are very efficient, effective on a micro scale (sometimes, there are many examples inefficient Christian charities), however, they are not really effective on broad scale, national level.
    If you're going to be poor, it's preferable to do it in a rich area, and then you have a good choice of well-funded charities to help you. Whereas being poor in a poor area... not such a good choice.

    Obviously, if you leave helping those in need up to charity, you get very uneven and non-standardized coverage nationally. In some areas the charity might be really really good. In others there might be none. I would say that, in general, if we want to see those in need helped, such extreme variation isn't really acceptable, and there needs to be an organized national entity (e.g. a government) ensuring that everyone receives at least a certain minimum level of assistance which is standardized nationwide. If local charities can help some people more in addition to that, great.

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