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Thread: Facts and science or anointed handkerchiefs?

  1. #31
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
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    It looks poorly on Christians when Browne and Falwell are the poster children for proudly flaunting the restrictions now that spring break is over but the fact that freedom of religion is a relevant principle is inescapable. This doesn't help Falwell here, but if this continues for months, I think Christians will be right to stop taking "no" for an answer for church attendance.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  2. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.
  3. #32
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    once people start getting sick in these Word of Faith churches, and they can't be "cured" by the snake oil preacher, maybe they will finally realize what phony they have been following.

    Note, I do believe God can and does heal people, but NOT on command in a circus set up to promote sales of handkerchiefs, anointing oil and books.
    As a child in church I was told a story. God told a man that there was going to be a flood. God said to him: "Many lives will be lost, but I will save you." On the day of the flood a person offered to help this man who refused to be helped since God had promised to help him. Another person offered his help, the man refused to receive his help. A third person offered his help, same story. So, the person died. As soon as he arrived in heaven, he said to God "you promised to help me!" And God said: "Yes, and you refused to be helped all the three times I tried to help you."

    Now, I am not a preacher, but I think it is a rather interesting story. Why are those who rely on healing on command and phony stuff like that not just thankful that they are living in a world in which we can take our precortions in this situation and still get our food, still cover our basic needs and even talk on the phone, on webservices and the like? God has already saved them once by giving them knowledge on how to avoid the virus, or at least reduce the likelihood of getting affected. They should be thankful for that. If they believe in God, they should thank him for that.
    "That is the little thing, the small thing, which Trump demands of his followers: To call hot cold. To call black white. To call wrong right." Michael Gerson

  4. #33
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    As a child in church I was told a story. God told a man that there was going to be a flood. God said to him: "Many lives will be lost, but I will save you." On the day of the flood a person offered to help this man who refused to be helped since God had promised to help him. Another person offered his help, the man refused to receive his help. A third person offered his help, same story. So, the person died. As soon as he arrived in heaven, he said to God "you promised to help me!" And God said: "Yes, and you refused to be helped all the three times I tried to help you."

    Now, I am not a preacher, but I think it is a rather interesting story. Why are those who rely on healing on command and phony stuff like that not just thankful that they are living in a world in which we can take our precortions in this situation and still get our food, still cover our basic needs and even talk on the phone, on webservices and the like? God has already saved them once by giving them knowledge on how to avoid the virus, or at least reduce the likelihood of getting affected. They should be thankful for that. If they believe in God, they should thank him for that.
    yes.

  5. Amen Charles amen'd this post.
  6. #34
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    It looks poorly on Christians when Browne and Falwell are the poster children for proudly flaunting the restrictions now that spring break is over but the fact that freedom of religion is a relevant principle is inescapable. This doesn't help Falwell here, but if this continues for months, I think Christians will be right to stop taking "no" for an answer for church attendance.
    This, however, will apply to all religions and, at least where I live, non-religious communities as well. So if you think Christians should at some point no longer take no for an answer, would you think associations of Muslims, atheists, agnostics, buddhists and whomever should enjoy the same freedom? And can you live with the consequences of that?
    "That is the little thing, the small thing, which Trump demands of his followers: To call hot cold. To call black white. To call wrong right." Michael Gerson

  7. #35
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    yes.
    The amen was in error, I just wanted to reply. Seems a bit too self focused to amen that post though I appreaciate that you agree.

    We don't agree very often. But, then again, I don't tell stories from church very often.
    "That is the little thing, the small thing, which Trump demands of his followers: To call hot cold. To call black white. To call wrong right." Michael Gerson

  8. #36
    Troll Magnet Sparko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    The amen was in error, I just wanted to reply. Seems a bit too self focused to amen that post though I appreaciate that you agree.

    We don't agree very often. But, then again, I don't tell stories from church very often.
    Maybe it really is the end of the world!

  9. #37
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparko View Post
    Maybe it really is the end of the world!
    No man knows the hour!
    "That is the little thing, the small thing, which Trump demands of his followers: To call hot cold. To call black white. To call wrong right." Michael Gerson

  10. #38
    Professor KingsGambit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    This, however, will apply to all religions and, at least where I live, non-religious communities as well. So if you think Christians should at some point no longer take no for an answer, would you think associations of Muslims, atheists, agnostics, buddhists and whomever should enjoy the same freedom? And can you live with the consequences of that?
    Why would I not think so?
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  11. #39
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Why would I not think so?
    Well, I did not mean to be unfair, but I have talked to people who seem to think only Christians should have that right (because they are right, important to society and the rest, while people like me are just spreading falsehoods and stuff like that). I did not mean to imply you were think along those lines and I am sorry if it appeared like that.

    Perhaps the last question is the most important then. Since we can then all meet again, how do you deal with the consequences it is going to have and how would you explain that you put other people's lives at risk in order to worship a God who also told you to take care of those in need and who will now be exposed to danger?
    "That is the little thing, the small thing, which Trump demands of his followers: To call hot cold. To call black white. To call wrong right." Michael Gerson

  12. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles View Post
    Well, I did not mean to be unfair, but I have talked to people who seem to think only Christians should have that right (because they are right, important to society and the rest, while people like me are just spreading falsehoods and stuff like that). I did not mean to imply you were think along those lines and I am sorry if it appeared like that.

    Perhaps the last question is the most important then. Since we can then all meet again, how do you deal with the consequences it is going to have and how would you explain that you put other people's lives at risk in order to worship a God who also told you to take care of those in need and who will now be exposed to danger?
    Remember that this mass quarantine exercise is only experiment. And the measures taken are extreme ones when it may only be necessary to just protect the older population in typical fashion or slightly stepped up fashion. Are we to harm all of society rather than take more conservative precautions?

    The big experiment happening now is whether governments can work out ways to take away the rights of people. Many governors are happy trying this out.

  13. Amen NorrinRadd amen'd this post.

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