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Thread: God.

  1. #1
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    God.

    Four of the things which define God. Yes, there are more.
    1. Uncaused.
    2. Invisible.
    3. Infinite.
    4. Omnipresent.

    Acts 17:28, "In Him we live and move and have our being . . . ."
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  2. #2
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    Four of the things which define God. Yes, there are more.
    1. Uncaused.
    2. Invisible.
    3. Infinite.
    4. Omnipresent.

    Acts 17:28, "In Him we live and move and have our being . . . ."
    Sounds like pantheism to me.

  3. #3
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Sounds like pantheism to me.
    JimL, it would seem that you do not know the difference between everywhere and everything.
    In elementary school it was taught the difference between who, what, when, where, how and why.

    God in being everywhere does not make God to be everything. Pantheism teaches a false god that is everything.
    Last edited by 37818; 04-04-2020 at 09:16 PM.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  4. Amen Chrawnus amen'd this post.
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    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    Sounds like pantheism to me.
    You live and move and have your being in the universe to which you belong as a part.

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    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    You live and move and have your being in the universe to which you belong as a part.
    The universe is everything that is in existence. God is not everything that is in existence.
    The universe is made up of things which are caused. God is uncaused.

    JimL, I cannot fix your apparent inabilty to understand differences.

    The universe is made up of space and matter. While space is throughtout the universe, space is defined by matter.
    So space is everywhere in the universe, but is not really omnipresent. God is omnipresent. God is uncaused.

    Soace and matter are not the same things. God and the universe are not the same things. I would think you really understand this.
    Last edited by 37818; 04-05-2020 at 09:01 AM.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  7. #6
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    The universe is everything that is in existence.
    I tend to agree with you on that.

    God is not everything that is in existence.
    Obviously not, unless you're a pantheist of course.

    The universe is made up of things which are caused.
    Caused by what, the universe to which they belong?

    God is uncaused.
    Well, by definition, yes. But the definition is dependent upon his actual existing.
    JimL, I cannot fix your apparent inabilty to understand differences.
    No, apparently not.
    The universe is made up of space and matter. While space is throughtout the universe, space is defined by matter.
    So space is everywhere in the universe, but is not really omnipresent. God is omnipresent. God is uncaused.
    I understand, you believe that the universe is finite, and that it exists within God who is infinite, ergo omnipresent. But to exist within a thing is to be a part of that thing, such as the atoms that make up the universe, as well as making up the particular things in the universe, are all part of the universe. We live and move in spacetime, which itself exists in the greator infinite Cosmos out of which it was born, not in an immaterial spirit.
    Soace and matter are not the same things. God and the universe are not the same things. I would think you really understand this.
    I do understand, God and the universe are not the same things, therefore we do not live and move in God, we live and move in the universe which is the cause our existence.

  8. #7
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    I tend to agree with you on that.


    Obviously not, unless you're a pantheist of course.


    Caused by what, the universe to which they belong?


    Well, by definition, yes. But the definition is dependent upon his actual existing.

    No, apparently not.

    I understand, you believe that the universe is finite, and that it exists within God who is infinite, ergo omnipresent. But to exist within a thing is to be a part of that thing, such as the atoms that make up the universe, as well as making up the particular things in the universe, are all part of the universe. We live and move in spacetime, which itself exists in the greator infinite Cosmos out of which it was born, not in an immaterial spirit.

    I do understand, God and the universe are not the same things, therefore we do not live and move in God, we live and move in the universe which is the cause our existence.
    There are some points of disagreement which need to be addressed.

    But to exist within a thing is to be a part of that thing, . . .
    That is how you think. I cannot change your mind on this. You need to do that yourself.
    But it is not necessarily true. For an example. A fish lives in water. And water is part of the fish. But the fish is not part of water even though it is part of the water that it is in. A fish is not the H2O. It is not part of H2O. But it is part of the body of water that it is in.

    God is the uncaused reality. But not all of reality is part of God. Without the uncaused reality there could not be all of reality. The reality we know as the universe. Arguably, the universe can include God. Since God being omnipresent would need be in the universe. Yet it is the universe which is in God who is uncaused. The universe is not part of God, but God is part of the universe, being that God is omnipresent and cannot not be omnipresent. That is the truth you are grappling with.

    God cannot not be. So to say there is no God is to necessarly deny that God is God.

    Uncaused realtiy is what God is. Caused realities is what God is not. The universe by what it is defined cannot not have God as part of it. But again, the universe is not part of God. Only if there was no created things at all would God and the universe be one and the same thing.

    Key: God is uncaused.
    Last edited by 37818; 04-05-2020 at 12:05 PM.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  9. #8
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    There are some pints of disagreement which need to be addressed.

    That is how you think. I cannot change your mind on this. You need to do that yourself.
    But it is not necessarily true. For an example. A fish lives in water. And water is part of the fish. But the fish is not part of water even though it is part of the water that it is in. A fish is not the H2O. It is not part of H2O. But it is part of the body of water that it is in.

    God is the uncaused reality. But not all of reality is part of God. Without the uncaused reality there could not be all of reality. The reality we know as the universe. Arguably, the universe can include God. Since God being omnipresent would need be in the universe. Yet it is the universe which is in God which us uncaused. The universe is not part of God, but God is part of the universe, being that God omnipresent and cannot not be omnipresent. That is the truth you are grapling with.

    God cannot not be. So to say there is no God is to necessarly deny that God is God.

    Uncaused realtiy is what God is. Caused realities is what God is not. The universe by what it is defined cannot not have God as part of it. But angain, the universe is not part of God. Only if there was no created things at all would God and the universe be one and the same thing.

    Key: God is uncaused.
    The fish in the water lives and moves in spacetime, it's all a part of the same spacetime universe. The material can't be said to live and move in the immaterial.

  10. #9
    tWebber 37818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimL View Post
    The fish in the water lives and moves in spacetime, it's all a part of the same spacetime universe. The material can't be said to live and move in the immaterial.
    Space time though it is throughout the whole universe is local. The Sun is about 8 minutes away from Earth and the Earth is about 8 minutes away from our Sun. Space time is matter dependant. And matter is space time depentant. Gravity.

    God's is uncaused, infinite, invisible and omnipresent. which places everything in space time in Him. Being God is omnipresent.

    It is true we live and move and have our being in space time. But that does not negate we living and moving and having our being in God, God being that He is omnipresent.

    Acts 17:28, "In Him we live and move and have our being . . . ." Remains true.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  11. #10
    tWebber
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    Quote Originally Posted by 37818 View Post
    Space time though it is throughout the whole universe is local. The Sun is about 8 minutes away from Earth and the Earth is about 8 minutes away from our Sun. Space time is matter dependant. And matter is space time depentant. Gravity.
    I think you mean eight minutes by way of light speed. But I don't know what that has to do with anything.
    God's is uncaused, infinite, invisible and omnipresent. which places everything in space time in Him. Being God is omnipresent.
    God, he must be ginormous!
    It is true we live and move and have our being in space time. But that does not negate we living and moving and having our being in God, God being that He is omnipresent.
    Acts 17:28, "In Him we live and move and have our being . . . ." Remains true.
    Okay, if you say so, I guess it must be true!

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